In other words, Tesla just went carbon positive.
Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index
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Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index
#222As a store of value, bitcoin does not compare to fiat but to other forms of hard money such as gold. During Bretton-woods, the US dollar and other currencies were redeemable for gold and no one was saying that the US dollar was polluting the world because gold mining is polluting. Comparing the environmental impact of gold and bitcoin is an open question. Gold mining pollutes the world in ways bitcoin never will. It…
> bitcoin will create additional demand for cheap renewable and accelerate the green transition
Bitcoin does not create demand for renewable energy. Bitcoin only creates demand for energy. If bitcoin had significant demand for "cheap renewable energy", then we should have seen bitcoin mining operations concentrating in locations where renewable energy is abundant and land is pretty much useless for anything else. This has not happened in reality.
Furthermore, even if we assume that bitcoin does put demand on renewable energy, since bitcoin mining does not replace other consumers, it is an additional overall energy demand. As long as bitcoin energy consumption grows faster than new renewable installations it effectively runs on carbon.
Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index
#223I'm tired of this BS about Bitcoin and pollution. So tired that yesterday I wrote this [0]. Of course you might be in complete disagreement with me, but please read it and let me know what you think. Be kind. I am trying to have a good conversation about it, not to impose my view. [0]: https://simon.medium.com/bitcoin-and-pollution-the-definitiv...
You'll have a hard time convincing people that Bitcoin is OK by comparing it gold since most people who think Bitcoin is wasteful would also think mining of gold is very wasteful. Moreover, I feel like you're making the mistake you highlight in your first paragraph: conflating 'mining' in gold with 'mining' in BTC. Bitcoin mining is necessary for transactions to occur, not so for gold. It's a very foggy comparison as…
It would be more apt to comparing the cost of transacting Bitcoin to that of recycling gold instead of mining it, which is not zero, but is substantially less than mining and that's where again, Bitcoin takes another lump. Recycled gold is useful; it's a precious metal obviously and one immune to most forms of oxidation, so once reclaimed, it can be used again in the next generation of smartphones and what have you.
Gold is however undoubtedly a good comparison pick for Bitcoin; it's something with a few natural pros on it's side that's been hideously overvalued for largely irrational reasons. Like... this metal is advertised as the "right" basis to back currency but I also have some of it in nearly every gadget I own? Then how rare can it possibly be if a small amount comes in a $15 audio decoder for goodness sakes!?
Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index
#224Perhaps not all of it is entirely "wasted" though. I've largely been able to avoid heating this winter as a result of crypto mining. A computer pumping ~300W into the air 24/7 is remarkably effective for a small apartment
> Perhaps not all of it is entirely "wasted" though. I've largely been able to avoid heating this winter as a result of crypto mining.
I am telling myself the same thing when I play videogames. :-)
Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index
#225From what I understand bitcoin currently has a $20+ transaction fee with a transaction time takes 60 minutes+ With these issues in addition to the high power consumption, how will Bitcoin become a usable currency?
I have no position in Bitcoin, but isn’t it possible for “BTC scrip” to be the money used day to day. With actual blockchain transactions just being used to aggregate at the institutional level? This is pretty much the way money worked in the 19th century, just with gold instead of BTC. Nobody physically carried or transferred gold to buy a beer. They just used bank notes that were backed by a trusted intermediary ho…
You're talking about a BTC bearer bond. Isn't that just what cash used to be? You've gone full circle.
Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index
#226Earlier quoted context omitted.
Will anyone criminalise the US army because they use lots of energy? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_usage_of_the_United_Sta... The answer: they might try, but good luck with that.
> Will anyone criminalise the US army because they use lots of energy? Ah yes, the old trope that people use the US dollar because they are forced to. Meanwhile, back in reality, people around the world are desperate to get their hands on USD for commerce, because it's easily transacted, accepted and valued anywhere . You know, kinda like Bitcoin purports to be, but way more common.
Arguably, modern currencies are backed by the ability of nation states to demand tax payments in them, creating a steady and stable (due to being directly proportional to economic activity) demand for them.
A currency having value abroad is arguably a side effect, not the main goal.
Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index
#227Slightly off topic, but does anyone have any good resources on how alternative consensus protocols work, like proof of stake and proof of importance? I either see really simplistic explanations or ones that assume a lot of domain knowledge. I also recently saw a crypto coin that claims to be energy efficient, and I don’t quite understand how that’s possible without the possibility of a 50.1% attack.
Proof of stake is relatively simple. You agree to stake a minimum amount of tokens (decided on by the network) and you get to run a node and validate transactions. If you attest to a malicious block and other validators call you out on it, you get slashed (i.e. you lose some portion of your stake, if not all of it): https://ethereum.org/en/developers/docs/consensus-mechanisms... One of the problems with it is that it…
>no single holder owns more than 1% of ETH, for example
Curious about this statement. Is this something that can be looked up online? I know wallets/transactions are entirely public so I guess its just a question of whether someone has made a tool to do this with ETH or other cryptos. How do other coins fair in the same regard? What's BTC distribution? LTC? Or any of their forks?
Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index
#228Does anyone know how much energy the global gold mining industry uses?
Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index
#229Energy consumption doesn't cause emissions.
Energy production causes emissions.
Reducing consumption (by shaming it, in this case) means less investment in production, because there's less demand. This could slow the green energy transition.
Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index
#230Earlier quoted context omitted.
I use it as a currency for years. Especially for large transactions internationally, where my bank asks me+the other party to fees like $30 and it takes 3 days if everything goes well. In comparison with that, BTC for those years, gave me on average 40 minutes and $1 fee. This is thirty times better than what my bank provides.
I use TransferWise in those situations. It works great.
I use TW too. But it doesn't work with post-soviet countries. It doesn't work to Vietnam. It doesn't work to Iran.