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Facebook sued for ‘losing control’ of users’ data

bbc.com

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Re: Facebook sued for ‘losing control’ of users’ data

#91

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

CivBase wrote: post #76
efdee wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that my friend gave my info to someone else. My friend allowed the app to ask Facebook information about me. In the end, it's still Facebook who handed over my data. That my friend decided that was OK doesn't change much.

As I understand, it was a browser extension which scraped data off the Facebook pages visited by users. There is no way Facebook could reasonably detect or combat that.

> As I understand, it was a browser extension which scraped data off the Facebook pages visited by users.

That is false:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facebook%E2%80%93Cambridge_Ana...

Re: Facebook sued for ‘losing control’ of users’ data

#92

Post by prostoalex »

ginko wrote: post #12
Nextgrid wrote: post #3

I'm no Facebook fan but the reasons behind the lawsuit are bad and could set a bad precedent. Cambridge Analytica used the Facebook API to ask users to share data about them & their friends. Stupid users agreed to that. The argument here isn't that Facebook is playing fast and loose with tracking & user data (which would be a legitimate argument), it's that Facebook is allowing people to grant access to their data to…

>The argument here isn't that Facebook is playing fast and loose with tracking & user data (which would be a legitimate argument), it's that Facebook is allowing people to grant access to their data to third-parties and Facebook should somehow be faulted for that. Even so you wrote yourself that users shared data about their friends. Why does Facebook allow people to share the data of others who didn't agree to this?

> Why does Facebook allow people to share the data of others who didn't agree to this?

"Why did Facebook allow" - they changed the practice on friends' data sharing a few years ago.

Every app that implores you to import your phone contacts does this.

Re: Facebook sued for ‘losing control’ of users’ data

#93

Post by robbyking »

mrits wrote: post #65

This submitter bmcn2020 spams this site with just enough bad articles to cover up all the other links to his own website. I don't understand why they allow that here.

The HN Guidelines[1] say "It's ok to post your own stuff occasionally, but the primary use of the site should be for curiosity." They may not be following the intent of the rule, but it looks like they are following the rule as it's written.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Facebook sued for ‘losing control’ of users’ data

#94

Post by Nextgrid »

efdee wrote: post #64
CivBase wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you told Facebook to give someone access to your personal information and they took it and handed it off to a third party, what is Facebook supposed to do about that? What can Facebook do about that? What could any website do about that? I despise Facebook, but I really don't understand this whole Cambridge Analytica thing. There doesn't appear to be an endgame for those criticizing Facebook over the ordeal. Of al…

It's not that my friend gave my info to someone else. My friend allowed the app to ask Facebook information about me. In the end, it's still Facebook who handed over my data. That my friend decided that was OK doesn't change much.

> My friend allowed the app to ask Facebook information about me.

Unless there's a major security vulnerability, you can only delegate access to data you have access yourself. So your friend did the equivalent of giving Cambridge Analytica your data - the technical implementation of it (as to whether CA got the data off your friend's phone or from Facebook directly) doesn't really change the outcome.

Re: Facebook sued for ‘losing control’ of users’ data

#95

Post by zaphar »

indigochill wrote: post #21
ginko wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The argument here isn't that Facebook is playing fast and loose with tracking & user data (which would be a legitimate argument), it's that Facebook is allowing people to grant access to their data to third-parties and Facebook should somehow be faulted for that. Even so you wrote yourself that users shared data about their friends. Why does Facebook allow people to share the data of others who didn't agree to this?

If I put on my blinders against this being Facebook for a moment, supposing that you're on a social network in which your friend is someone you personally trust, then it's not that ridiculous to trust that person with the decision to share your data. In a very limited way, you kind of expect this (your friend giving your number to someone who they think you'll get along with, or whatever). This goes a bit sideways on…

    In a very limited way, you kind of expect this
    (your friend giving your number to someone who they 
    think you'll get along with, or whatever).
I absolutely do not expect this. Nor would I be okay with a friend sharing my number to someone they think I'll get along with. I don't think I'm alone in this either.

Re: Facebook sued for ‘losing control’ of users’ data

#96

Post by ysavir »

dfxm12 wrote: post #54
Nextgrid wrote: post #3

I'm no Facebook fan but the reasons behind the lawsuit are bad and could set a bad precedent. Cambridge Analytica used the Facebook API to ask users to share data about them & their friends. Stupid users agreed to that. The argument here isn't that Facebook is playing fast and loose with tracking & user data (which would be a legitimate argument), it's that Facebook is allowing people to grant access to their data to…

Cambridge Analytica used the Facebook API to ask users to share data about them & their friends. Stupid users agreed to that. According to Facebook, this is not what happened and CA's collection of this data represented a breach in their platform policies [0]: In 2015, we learned that a psychology professor at the University of Cambridge named Dr. Aleksandr Kogan lied to us and violated our Platform Policies by passi…

And does anything about this make Facebook liable for the way CA used the data willingly given to them by their users?

Facebook is either:

1. a neutral party, acting on the wishes of its users, who asked to grant CA access to their data. The victims are users and the aggressor is CA for misusing data.

Or:

2. a victim party, after CA went against their policies. CA is the aggressor in this scenario, and the users are not part of the equation.

Re: Facebook sued for ‘losing control’ of users’ data

#97

Post by CivBase »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #91
CivBase wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I understand, it was a browser extension which scraped data off the Facebook pages visited by users. There is no way Facebook could reasonably detect or combat that.

> As I understand, it was a browser extension which scraped data off the Facebook pages visited by users. That is false: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facebook%E2%80%93Cambridge_Ana...

Nevermind. I thought it was a browser extension. I was not aware of the "Open Graph" platform. Thank you for the correction.

Re: Facebook sued for ‘losing control’ of users’ data

#99

Post by dfxm12 »

hunter-gatherer wrote: post #31
manux wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Facebook is allowing people to grant access to their data to third-parties and Facebook should somehow be faulted for that. It's not clear to me that they shouldn't be faulted. How many people read terms and conditions? How many people lack the technological literacy to understand what it means to share their facebook data with third-parties? It seems to me like we should make our systems robust to the average user…

> It's not clear to me that they shouldn't be faulted. How many people read terms and conditions? How many people lack the technological literacy to understand what it means to share their facebook data with third-parties? I'm not trying to argue here, but I see this argument pop up often when discussing big tech and user data. I'm curious why the tone is so different when it comes to mortgages or auto loans, for exa…

It seems society is content with the notion that I must do my ow due diligence when buying a home, but for whatever reason that responsibility seems to slide away when I'm dealing with social media. Why is that?

Counterpoint: I'm not content with opaque mortgage or auto loan terms (although my last auto loan was actually quite simple). I don't think you can generalize how "society" feels in this way.

This also happens to be a recent hot button issue. If you talked to someone in, oh say, late 2008, mortgages might've been on the front of their mind.

Re: Facebook sued for ‘losing control’ of users’ data

#100

Post by jagged-chisel »

shanemlk wrote: post #98

Why do my comments keep getting down voted? How much more obvious can it be that zuckerburg has caused more damage to the Earth than good? WHY DO I HAVE TO DEFEND MYSELF FOR SUCH A CLEARLY OBVIOUS OPINION? You are "HACKERS". Start acting like it.

Probably because the language you chose to use is less than civil.
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