Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future • Hacker News Board

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#821

Post by BenoitEssiambre » Mon, Feb 08, 2021, 5:27 PM UTC

astrolince wrote: post #683

BenoitEssiambre wrote: post #381

Oh noes, if this starts a trend, becomes widespread, and businesses start hoarding crypto tokens instead of investing in building stuff, it could cause a great depression pretty much the same way gold hoarding caused the economy to collapse in 1929. When people, businesses and banks start hording tokens instead of investing in building and maintaining the production capacity of consumables, the ratio of value of toke…

You can't invest everything you have, that generates bad investment decisions that doesn't generate products that the market actually demands, it destroys the economy

Note that on the aggregate, all savings are either investment (infrastructure/inventory etc), or some form of promise/IOUs from others (indirectly backed by their future labor). A certain amount of promise type savings is normal for inter generational consumption transfers (retirees depending on the young working instead of them).

But when too many people's savings are in the form of promises and everybody owe each other their savings, do people really have much savings?

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#822

Post by root_axis » Mon, Feb 08, 2021, 5:39 PM UTC

mrb wrote: post #802

tiborsaas wrote: post #728

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is not a single alternative service in the world that would have made this possible. I work at TransferWise so I know that 34% of our transactions are now instant (less than 20 sec).

It's impossible for 2 new unverified users to sign up to your service and send money instantly within 1 hour, cash in hand. Lengthy verification steps, etc. So TW wouldn't have worked in our urgent situation.

It's impossible for two new unverified users to obtain "cash in hand" with bitcoin since you need a bank account and KYC to turn bitcoin into usable money in an urgent situation.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#823

Post by WrtCdEvrydy » Mon, Feb 08, 2021, 5:39 PM UTC

FabHK wrote: post #664

lm28469 wrote: post #557

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> While away on vacation, I once sent $1000 in cold hard cash, on a Sunday, to an unbanked person in Los Angeles, in less than 1 hour, thanks to bitcoin and the recipient withdrawing it for cash at a Bitcoin ATM. There is not a single alternative service in the world that would have made this possible. And this is reason enough to replace all other currencies with btc ? Because it's fast ? If people thought a little…

> Because it's fast ? Not that fast: for most purposes you have to wait about an hour. Not as fast as centralised fast systems.

2 confirmations is usually enough for most transactions. 6 confirmations guarantees the money will never be reversed.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#824

Post by mrb » Mon, Feb 08, 2021, 5:41 PM UTC

macspoofing wrote: post #592

mrb wrote: post #489

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While away on vacation, I once sent $1000 in cold hard cash, on a Sunday, to an unbanked person in Los Angeles, in less than 1 hour, thanks to bitcoin and the recipient withdrawing it for cash at a Bitcoin ATM. There is not a single alternative service in the world that would have made this possible. If people thought a little beyond their personal use cases, they would understand the utility of Bitcoin/crypto for ma…

>There is not a single alternative service in the world that would have made this possible. Are you kidding me? >If people thought a little beyond their personal use cases, they would understand the utility of Bitcoin/crypto for many others. What use case is that? Skirting AML regulations? You think governments will allow that?

«What use case is that?»

Sending money to an unbanked person in severe financial hardship, for food & shelter. Nothing else worked. Not WU. Not TW.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#825

Post by p0nce » Mon, Feb 08, 2021, 5:43 PM UTC

fasteddie31003 wrote: post #643

p0nce wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm tired of always hearing from Crypto. It's just money, and it doesn't solve any problem. It's beyond boring honestly.

Look into smart contracts. If you find the possibilities of smart contracts boring, I'd like to hear what makes you excited about the future? My lawyer friend who makes derivative contracts mind got blown away by the possibilities of smart contracts replacing every derivative contract he writes.

It's a neat idea that I don't want to hear about more than once a year, at most.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#826

Post by FabHK » Mon, Feb 08, 2021, 5:43 PM UTC

charcircuit wrote: post #758

FabHK wrote: post #658

1. I see a securities fraud class action lawsuit coming up if (when?) that tanks. 2. Accepting Bitcoin as payment is not a big deal, really. It would be remarkable when they denominate things in BTC. Say, you can buy a Model 3 for 1.1 BTC (and, just to be clear, when BTC-USD changes, it still sells at 1.1 BTC, and whatever the then new USD price is). That would be something. That's not going to happen, of course.

If you were referring to bitcoin, it isn't a security.

Tesla issues shares. People might buy the shares based on what Tesla said it was going to do, then Tesla buys BTC, then BTC tanks, Tesla shares drop, people sue Tesla.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#827

Post by mrb » Mon, Feb 08, 2021, 5:43 PM UTC

lm28469 wrote: post #557

mrb wrote: post #489

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While away on vacation, I once sent $1000 in cold hard cash, on a Sunday, to an unbanked person in Los Angeles, in less than 1 hour, thanks to bitcoin and the recipient withdrawing it for cash at a Bitcoin ATM. There is not a single alternative service in the world that would have made this possible. If people thought a little beyond their personal use cases, they would understand the utility of Bitcoin/crypto for ma…

> While away on vacation, I once sent $1000 in cold hard cash, on a Sunday, to an unbanked person in Los Angeles, in less than 1 hour, thanks to bitcoin and the recipient withdrawing it for cash at a Bitcoin ATM. There is not a single alternative service in the world that would have made this possible. And this is reason enough to replace all other currencies with btc ? Because it's fast ? If people thought a little…

«replace all other currencies with btc»

What's up with this mindset that Bitcoin must REPLACE the existing system? As a Bitcoin user for 10+ years I always envisioned Bitcoin would simply co-exist with the rest. Your mind is too binary, my friend.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#828

Post by mac01021 » Mon, Feb 08, 2021, 5:44 PM UTC

pontifier wrote: post #479

rzodkiew wrote: post #338

Bitcoin is a mystery to me. Somehow it's hailed as revolutionising the economy, by replacing currency with a worse kind of currency. It feels like this is where all the "how to get rich quick" book writers and other hustle bros went and created one giant financial pyramid, which works in quite simple way: - buy bitcoin - tell everyone around how revolutionary it is, so they buy it and what you holding increases in va…

>You know what would be revolutionary? Getting rid of currency altogether. I agree. The future is not keeping track. If someone needs something they should have it. The only reason that hasn't happened is scarcity and logistics, which I believe we will solve in the not so distant future.

The problem is that people need so little and that 98% of commerce consists of people transacting for something more than the bare minimum of staying alive.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#829

Post by mrb » Mon, Feb 08, 2021, 5:44 PM UTC

iagovar wrote: post #619

mrb wrote: post #489

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While away on vacation, I once sent $1000 in cold hard cash, on a Sunday, to an unbanked person in Los Angeles, in less than 1 hour, thanks to bitcoin and the recipient withdrawing it for cash at a Bitcoin ATM. There is not a single alternative service in the world that would have made this possible. If people thought a little beyond their personal use cases, they would understand the utility of Bitcoin/crypto for ma…

You can do that with SEPA? I mean, I just send money to my landlord every 1st day of the month, and I got it automated in my bank page. And every bank account I had has this.

No. Recipient was unbanked, under severe financial hardship.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#830

Post by webinvest » Mon, Feb 08, 2021, 5:48 PM UTC

lottin wrote: post #322

This is very worrying. Don't they have financial advisors at Tesla? An automaker should focus on making cars. This is what they specialise in and what they are good at. They should not be speculating with financial assets. Tesla shareholders can do that themselves, if they wish to.

Tesla stock jumped up 2% today on the news. If you think TSLA stock is overvalued, you can short it but there is a graveyard of dead shorts and pairs of red satin short shorts to commemorate it.

Personally, I’ve wondered why this hadn’t all happened sooner with companies. However often times Tesla is the trailblazer and the other companies copy & follow.