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Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

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Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#621

Post by bhupy »

rzodkiew wrote: post #609
bhupy wrote: post #367

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm still forming an opinion on cryptocurrency. You mention that decentralization is a very important step that we should try to take as a society. If that's the case, then why isn't Bitcoin (or PeerCoin etc etc) a step function revolution?

Because they are not really decentralised. Vast amounts of cryptocurrencies as they are designed right now are disproportionately held by the early adopters, who will inevitably engage in rent seeking in one way or another (I wish I was wrong on this one). Decentralisation has to happen through increasing trust between people, while cryptocurrencies are designed to replace trust. Yeah, current institutions controllin…

I think everything you said is correct about Bitcoin, but is that true of cryptocurrency in general?

I think Bitcoin, which has its obvious flaws, is sort of the de facto flag-bearer of crypto, and more of a harbinger of things to come. I'm not yet convinced that Bitcoin will be the only cryptocurrency in widespread use, in the same way that the USD isn't the only fiat currency used in the world today.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#622

Post by diegoperini »

bryanlarsen wrote: post #540
mrb wrote: post #489

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While away on vacation, I once sent $1000 in cold hard cash, on a Sunday, to an unbanked person in Los Angeles, in less than 1 hour, thanks to bitcoin and the recipient withdrawing it for cash at a Bitcoin ATM. There is not a single alternative service in the world that would have made this possible. If people thought a little beyond their personal use cases, they would understand the utility of Bitcoin/crypto for ma…

Western Union has been doing this for > 150 years.

In places (such as here, Turkey) where local currency has much less value than the USD, Western Union is simply beyond affordable.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#623

Post by sixQuarks »

pelliphant wrote: post #410
sixQuarks wrote: post #385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do people price things in gold? So, is gold not a serious thing?

It is uncommon for sure. But then again, now days, most people don't consider gold as a serious currency.

That's because it's not a currency. It's a store of value.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#624

Post by qqii »

bearjaws wrote: post #547
sixQuarks wrote: post #406

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me explain bitcoin in a way that hackers will understand. Bitcoin is javascript. Hackers don't like javascript. It's got a lot of terrible quirks. There are so many languages better than javascript. But that doesn't matter. Javascript is ubiquitous, and you can't avoid it. Bitcoin is the same. Either you accept it as the way things are and profit from it, or you keep pounding your head against the wall.

Yeah but Javascript can actually be used to create a blockchain or any number of applications. I bet SpaceX could land a Falcon-9 with Javascript if they wanted nightmare difficulty. Bitcoin's main purpose for everyone I know is to buy drugs and treat as an 'investment'.

Bitcoin is currently accepted by a large number of companies including Microsoft, Newegg and Namecheap. We've seen greater use in counties like Venezuela.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#625

Post by charcircuit »

EtienneK wrote: post #380

I love the idea of Bitcoin. But, as someone who's been working in banking for more than a decade - what problem does Bitcoin solve? Serious question; 'cause I'm failing to come up with a good answer. Edit: The closest I've come to answering this: To me Bitcoin is more a decentralized international payment protocol (such as SWIFT); not a store of value / currency. But I rarely see it being pitched in that way.

Bitcoin solves the problem of a trustless money system. If you do trust the current money system I think it more importantly kickstarted research into decentralized finance.

For example with cryptocurrency I can within seconds get a loan. That is just not possible with the current financial system. This also leads into the concept of flash. loans where you can borrow as much money as you want as long as you return it in the same transaction.

Another thing cryptocurrency allows is for micropayments. Images hiring someone and paying them per second where they can instantly spend what they have earned instead of having to wait for a payday.

Another thing cryptocurrency allows for is trading digital assets atomically such that you don't need a middleman. Imagine you wanted to buy a video game item from someone. Instead of having to worry about being scammed you can setup a transaction where both assets are exchanged at the same time avoiding a potential middleman and avoiding getting scammed.

Now most of this could be done with the old financial system, but the decentralized finance space is just moving faster than what the centralized finance space can keep up with.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#626

Post by fasteddie31003 »

pelliphant wrote: post #439
fasteddie31003 wrote: post #88

I don't understand all the Crypto hate on this site. Since when have hackers become the luddites to new ways of finance?

I'm a crypto hater, I consider bitcoin to be a pyramid scheme. And also, I think that it is a positive thing that an institution that I can influence (government) is in control of deciding how transactions work. This might also be a cultural thing, since I'm scandinavian, and "we" generally consider government regulation as something necessary.

To some aspect every asset is part pyramid scheme.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#627

Post by paxys »

eli wrote: post #386
sixQuarks wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Initially it was meant to be used as currency, but it's become more of an asset class now, mainly used as a store of value, similar to gold. Do you know how difficult it is to get millions of people to agree that something is a store of value, not only agree, but to put their money where their mouth is? THIS is why bitcoin is where it's at.

At least you can build useful things out of gold

You buy "useful" things out of gold only to show other people you have gold.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#628

Post by agloeregrets »

fasteddie31003 wrote: post #88

I don't understand all the Crypto hate on this site. Since when have hackers become the luddites to new ways of finance?

Crypto at this point makes zero sense as any future of finance. It doesn't work. It's pretty much vaporware that has been hyped to the point that people didn't realize it will never work mass-scale as is. The hype drove early holders to massive income (like an MLM scheme) but ledger uses so much massive energy and power to process transactions that it is HORRIBLE for planet earth. Like running Crypo on the global scale would involve power use on the scale of multiple first world countries combined that would get worse and worse as hardware limitations hit. In a few years of mass-scale use Cryto would use more power than pretty much planet earth. The only solution to this is developments in Eth. but thats still far off and has its own downsides.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#629

Post by mattm »

me551ah wrote: post #438
rzodkiew wrote: post #338

Bitcoin is a mystery to me. Somehow it's hailed as revolutionising the economy, by replacing currency with a worse kind of currency. It feels like this is where all the "how to get rich quick" book writers and other hustle bros went and created one giant financial pyramid, which works in quite simple way: - buy bitcoin - tell everyone around how revolutionary it is, so they buy it and what you holding increases in va…

I don't get why bitcoin is worth so much.Bitcoin is called a store of value like gold, but gold has inherent uses. If the price of gold went to zero then you could still use it to make jewellery or use it for electrical conductivity. If the price of bitcoin goes to zero then it's worthless. It's also not environmentally friendly and bitcoin mining uses up 0.21% of the world's power supply. And all of this energy is u…

Yeah this confused me for a long time as well. I then realized that there is tremendous value in something that acts as a reliable store of value.

For example, rich people are known to buy expensive art and then lock it away in a warehouse. Why do this? You're not getting any value out of the piece. The reason is that the sole purpose of the art piece is to be a reliable store of value. You're paying a lot for something that you know will hold its value.

This is what Bitcoin has become. It's valuable because it's valuable. And the fact that it has become more valuable over time (despite volatility) makes it even more valuable.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#630

Post by bryanlarsen »

latchkey wrote: post #586
bryanlarsen wrote: post #540

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Western Union has been doing this for > 150 years.

Have you ever tried to use Western Union while in a foreign country? I did it in Vietnam. Everything was a barrier. Language, paperwork, carrying cash around safely, time and finally most importantly, fees. No thanks.

The parent said that bitcoin was a "paradigm shift". Being slightly more convenient is not a "paradigm shift".
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