Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

davegooden.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

121–130 of 197 posts

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#121

Post by djloche »

Supposing Dave Gooden is correct...

The method seems risky at first, but when you think about the risk and how they solved the problem, it is perfectly acceptable.

To catch danger from unsolicited email (from the end recipient), the mail must first be reported. A complaint must be made. If the recipient doesn't report it, there is no action taken. Most of the time, it doesn't take but a few reports and then there are people digging into the scheme trying to figure out who is abusing the end users. This is because most people sending unsolicited email are not able to directly target their market. Viagra spammers have to send out boat loads of messages just to hit their market of old men with erectile disfunction who are too embarrassed to get the pills through traditional means AND not web savvy enough to realize that giving out their credit card information to a fly by night company selling drugs isn't the smartest idea.

Simply put - if you can directly target your market AND you have something that is game changing to those people - eg a superior product / experience / service compared to their current business efforts, you won't get flagged for spam. They'll check out your site, think it's the greatest, and become your customer because you make them money.

The problem for AirBnB was that Craigslist has evolved to try and prevent unsolicited mail of all kind - because most people or companies are NOT able to hit the sweet spot where they are sure that what they have to offer is exactly what the recipient wants, but doesn't know it until the email is received.

Having interns, family, friends, or other people who are genuinely excited about your business send email recommending it to exactly who will want it, without revealing their relationship to the business, is an acceptable, if temporary solution.

But you only need to build momentum, because if your product is amazing, the recipients of the previously unsolicited email will do all the word of mouth marketing for you.

So before you go and try and repeat this alleged successful route, make sure you have all the pieces to the puzzle before giving the mission a green light.

[cite: personal past experience at an ESP watching and doing the digging in resolving spam/fraud complaints]

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#122

Post by kwis »

llimllib wrote: post #23
MatthewB wrote: post #6

I love this. Being scrappy is one of the best qualities among entrepreneurs. The attitude of "do anything" to succeed usually results in success not to mention it is one of the characteristics that PG looks for in founders.

Even when it's illegal? Is this an action that you consider moral but illegal (re: CAN-SPAM and various state laws)? Should AirBnB's investors be worried about the potential liability of lawsuits? > Each separate email in violation of the CAN-SPAM Act is subject to penalties of up to $16,000 - http://business.ftc.gov/documents/bus61-can-spam-act-complia...

I'm very curious if they misrepresented the nature of their growth to their investors. If they did, they could be in violation of securities laws, in addition to CAN-SPAM.

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#123

Post by btilly »

qq66 wrote: post #120
btilly wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Citation needed Common usage that I've seen is to refer to the market cap as the value of the company. For a random example http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2010/03/19/how-does-ap... . The other common usage that I've seen is to refer to a company as being worth X billion a year . In that usage the a year bit is not dropped, because dropping it would introduce confusion with the first common usage.

I have no horse in this race, but $x billion company has traditionally referred to revenues. The usage of "___ company" to mean valuation is new (last five years), rare among traditional press outlets, and overrepresented among the startup/Silicon Valley crowd. The idiom may be changing in meaning, but if so, it's in the early stages.

Hmm, that doesn't fit with my recollection.

But when I Googled for "billion dollar company" then "million dollar company" the first usage I found that wasn't in some way tied to startups was http://www.goodnewsnetwork.org/most-popular//red-mill-goes-t... where it clearly refers to revenue.

Ah well. Around here there is no question which usage is more common.

PS You may be amused that the top hit for "x billion dollar company" is http://hackerne.ws/item?id=2033232 which involves you.

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#124

Post by dreamdu5t »

fuzzmeister wrote: post #56
prodigal_erik wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course. Email is the main immediate worldwide communication medium that isn't under the arbitrary control of one private owner. Spam is an existential threat to that, which makes it pretty much unforgivable. It's the price of a free society (and here's where I try to remind myself that really is worthwhile) that we can't impose an http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/I/Internet-Death-Penalty.htm... , but if we had some…

How is spam an existential threat to email? Spam filters have gotten exceptionally good, to the point where I find it hard to believe that anyone using a decent filter receives enough true spam in their inbox to make them stop using email altogether.

If you don't think so, please post your email here for us.

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#125

Post by [deleted] »

tlrobinson wrote: post #93

It's interesting that a lot of the recent billion dollar internet companies have some sort of gray/black hat streak. Off the top of my head: Groupon: "we've already seen businesses complaining that the Groupons didn't make them money, or that Groupon sales people suggested they raise their prices substantially just before the Groupon 'discount'." http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2011/05/why-does... Zynga:…

[deleted]

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#126

Post by kanamekun »

alain94040 wrote: post #79
techcofounder wrote: post #49

can we please get a response from one of the AirBnB founders?

I second that. What scares me the most is that no one from AirBnB came on that thread to strongly deny this article. And you know they read HN a lot and post often. So I'm sad.

I'm sure that their attorneys have let them know that acknowledging that they sent out spam would expose them to massive damages under the CAN-SPAM laws. So AirBnB can't really acknowledge what they did and try and move on... financially, it would be ruinous for them. They are probably hoping that the controversy will blow over, until the statute of limitations expires at which point they can apologize and blame the previous regime.

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#127

Post by kwis »

fuzzmeister wrote: post #56
prodigal_erik wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course. Email is the main immediate worldwide communication medium that isn't under the arbitrary control of one private owner. Spam is an existential threat to that, which makes it pretty much unforgivable. It's the price of a free society (and here's where I try to remind myself that really is worthwhile) that we can't impose an http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/I/Internet-Death-Penalty.htm... , but if we had some…

How is spam an existential threat to email? Spam filters have gotten exceptionally good, to the point where I find it hard to believe that anyone using a decent filter receives enough true spam in their inbox to make them stop using email altogether.

The spam filters today are good not because of magic, but because billions of dollars have been spent securing email.

What a complete and utter waste of resources.

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#128

Post by andymatic »

marcamillion wrote: post #113
thomasgerbe wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Is this 'grey' ? In the sense that it can be interpreted as 'shady' ? Hell yes. But is it "wrong" ? I don't think so." I post a listing on Craigslist specifically saying it's not "ok for others to contact me about other services, products or commercial interests" (an option in Craigslist) and then a business tries to convince me to use their site using a disguise DESPITE clearly stating that I don't want to be conta…

But wouldn't you say that's a bit unreasonable given that if you listed your apartment/house for rental on Craigslist - it can be safe to assume that you are interested in renting your house/apartment, no ? I think every 'savvy' user always checks those boxes, but if there is an option that allows you to actually fulfill your original intent - i.e. you got no hits on Craigslist, but with AirBnB you have tons of reque…

They said they didn't want to be contacted. It isn't up to others to decide that they are a special case. Any marketer would find the wiggle room to make their email a special case.

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#129

Post by dreamdu5t »

btilly wrote: post #97
dreamdu5t wrote: post #91

AirBnB is not a "Billion Dollar Company." Investment is not revenue or profit. The revenue numbers I heard are in the 5-10 million range. When AirBnB posts a billion dollars in revenue, then it will be a "Billion Dollar Company."

Sorry, you're absolutely wrong. The value of X, for any X at all, is what someone else is willing to pay for it. That is how markets work. Any kind of market. And it works for everything from pricing apples to pieces of art to companies. If people are willing to pay $1 billion for your company, it is a billion dollar company. If nobody is willing to pay you a dime for it, it is worth nothing. Your revenue is an input…

AirBnB has a history of clever and aggressive PR, and this title is probably deliberate in that regard.

The first three google results for "billion dollar company" all refer to companies with billions in revenue.

According to Google and every economics class I ever took, people assume it refers to revenue. In common vernacular, "billion dollar company" means a company that actually generated a billion dollars in revenue, not speculative investment.

I mean come on... why is it fair to refer to AirBnB as a billion dollar company when there are actually companies generating a billion in revenue?

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#130

Post by fuzzmeister »

dreamdu5t wrote: post #124
fuzzmeister wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is spam an existential threat to email? Spam filters have gotten exceptionally good, to the point where I find it hard to believe that anyone using a decent filter receives enough true spam in their inbox to make them stop using email altogether.

If you don't think so, please post your email here for us.

Multiple of my email addresses posted online unmasked multiple times, so I certainly get spam. My point is that filters are quite effective.
Post reply on HN