How to lower the price of plant-based meat • Hacker News Board

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#41

Post by dabbledash » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:11 PM UTC

avolcano wrote: post #10

sparrish wrote: post #2

It really shouldn't be called "meat". It should be called plant-based protein or meat-substitute. The definition of "meat" shouldn't change because you press some soy to look like a chicken leg.

I don't really understand this. I've never seen a package of plant-based meat and found myself confused, much in the same way I've never seen a carton of oat milk and thought it contained dairy. What's the concern here?

I don’t know about the meat issue, but I’ve seen women in mother’s groups ask “what kind of milk” people were going to be giving their babies after they were done giving breast milk or formula. Some people seemed to genuinely think that something called almond milk is actually a type of milk in some meaningful sense just because of the name.

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#42

Post by AlecSchueler » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:12 PM UTC

eznzt wrote: post #35

hannob wrote: post #30

Interestingly it doesn't even discuss the obvious solution: Let people who buy real meat pay for the externalities. (Interestingly even in places where there's some form of carbon pricing - like the EU - this often doesn't cover a large share of emissions from meat production, as methane emissions are very relevant here - I'm not aware of any methane pricing scheme anywhere.)

I was going to say "that won't go well with the voters" but it's not like the EU is a democracy.

The EU is a democracy.

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#43

Post by vz8 » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:12 PM UTC

Fresh fruit and veg prices have practically quadrupled in the last 10 years here (Florida). Beef is significantly up.

On the other hand, chicken is ridiculously inexpensive. For under $7, a tray of 8 oversized chicken thighs. Following a Keto regimen for a bit over a year now, I'm very keen on trying a different approach to high-protein, low-carb intake.

The novel proteins the article discusses (mung beans, potatoes, fava beans, chickpeas, lentils, oats, lupine, and faba) give me a wider array to try, but I can see how difficult plant-based meat pricing will be when the crops are so much more expensive than the corn/wheat/soy tri-fecta.

What keeps the novel crops pricing so high? (looks like 15 to 160 times higher than corn/wheat/soy at the extremes)

Labor?

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#44

Post by wtetzner » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:12 PM UTC

delibes wrote: post #16

cccc4all wrote: post #6

Cows and livestock eat plants and convert into meat. It’s natural and organic and proven process that’s been around for thousands of years. Ground up plants with food colorings and odd shapes are not meat.

Agreed. Some vegans/vegetarians don't want their food labelled meat either. However please don't compare the modern industrial meat production with anything like farming from, say, 500 years ago, or with ancient hunting. Modern meat production is brutal (for necessary cost reasons) and hugely destructive to the environment.

There are still sustainable farms, and you can of course encourage more of it by buying your meat from those.

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#45

Post by YeGoblynQueenne » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:15 PM UTC

avolcano wrote: post #10

sparrish wrote: post #2

It really shouldn't be called "meat". It should be called plant-based protein or meat-substitute. The definition of "meat" shouldn't change because you press some soy to look like a chicken leg.

I don't really understand this. I've never seen a package of plant-based meat and found myself confused, much in the same way I've never seen a carton of oat milk and thought it contained dairy. What's the concern here?

I don't see that the OP said anything about there being any kind of confusion. I think you're responding to a different concern than the one they expressed.

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#46

Post by danShumway » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:16 PM UTC

sparrish wrote: post #2

It really shouldn't be called "meat". It should be called plant-based protein or meat-substitute. The definition of "meat" shouldn't change because you press some soy to look like a chicken leg.

Is anyone really confused by this though?

To be honest, this sounds like the same controversy as people complaining about almond "milk". I just don't see a lot of evidence that people are regularly accidentally buying vegan food.

Meat has been used to refer to non-animal products for a long time, particularly around nuts. I don't think that the definition has changed as much as people are using a commonly understood term to refer to a category of food that's all used in similar situations and for similar purposes.

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#47

Post by Layke1123 » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:16 PM UTC

shmageggy wrote: post #21

Layke1123 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tried the impossible burger at Burger King. I could not tell a difference personally from any typical fast food burger. Would buy it again to satisfy a craving.

The Impossible burger is not cultured meat, it’s a plant-based product. OP is referring to this https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/dec/02/no-kill-...

Ah I misread his wording. I thought he was just asking for someone's opinion on restaurants that had served any meat alternative product, not specifically lab grown meat.

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#48

Post by Layke1123 » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:16 PM UTC

wavefunction wrote: post #18

Layke1123 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tried the impossible burger at Burger King. I could not tell a difference personally from any typical fast food burger. Would buy it again to satisfy a craving.

That's not cultured meat. It's plant-protein based.

See my response to another poster.

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#49

Post by aaronblohowiak » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:16 PM UTC

orange_tee wrote: post #38

hannob wrote: post #30

Interestingly it doesn't even discuss the obvious solution: Let people who buy real meat pay for the externalities. (Interestingly even in places where there's some form of carbon pricing - like the EU - this often doesn't cover a large share of emissions from meat production, as methane emissions are very relevant here - I'm not aware of any methane pricing scheme anywhere.)

Malnutrition is also an externality. I am not sure how healthy these options are but I suspect that substituting minced meat patties, for mashed vegetables glued together with cheap vegetable oils is not an nutritional improvement.

There are plenty of very healthy meat-avoiding people in the world. Malnutrition is also a problem in the world. Malnutrition from people eating fake meat? So far, not a problem.

Re: How to lower the price of plant-based meat

#50

Post by drewg123 » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:17 PM UTC

Layke1123 wrote: post #9

Combining a few points into one since they are related, but plant-based meat is a misnomer. Plant-based protein, or meat-substitute are better terms and meat should not have it's definition muddied. Lab grown meat from cultured cells, however, fair game. Trying to force companies to call it anything other than meat would be intentionally seeking to stifle innovation.

That ship has sailed a long time ago with dairy products. Just look at all the nut-based "milks" and "cheeses" and "yogurts".