NordVPN disables features when you turn off auto-renew • Hacker News Board

Re: NordVPN disables features when you turn off auto-renew

#141

Post by boring_twenties » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:00 PM UTC

vmception wrote: post #13

notRobot wrote: post #5

Honestly, nothing holds up to Mullvad [1]. They don't even take an email address while creating accounts, and you can pay easily with Bitcoin or even with cash mailed to them. I'm not affiliated, just a very happy customer. Mullvad is also who Mozilla trusts for the Mozilla VPN [2]. You can sign up with that if you'd like Mozilla to get a cut. [1]: https://mullvad.net/ [2]: https://vpn.mozilla.org/

How do they take bitcoin? I’ve seen various invoicing systems that completely break in Tor+JS and in all noJS environments. If they shoehorned bitpay in, its probably not tapping into the utility of having bitcoin payment options. I like paying invoices with Monero over Tor, while the merchant receives bitcoin that a third party pushed to them. I’ve been doing that for at least half a decade. But if I can’t access th…

I used to use Mullvad but got sick of having to pay them via Bitcoin (or Bitcoin Cash, lol). I emailed them about accepting Monero directly and they said something like "we would like to but it's too much work." Ended up switching to IVPN, which actually costs more but is worth it for me not to have to deal with those shitcoins.

Re: NordVPN disables features when you turn off auto-renew

#142

Post by dilyevsky » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:00 PM UTC

Stevvo wrote: post #84

wwwwwwwww wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nowadays its probably best to set up your own VPN server for that. Back when I lived there, most VPNs got occationally blocked, then they would get new IPs and work fine again. But from what I heard, it got way worse since Winnie the Pooh took over.

They often block VPN traffic at the protocol level i.e. even rolling your own is going to be a headache. That said, I never had problems using an SSH tunnel and the end result is the same.

Heh if they blocked ssh my access logs would be considerably leaner

Re: NordVPN disables features when you turn off auto-renew

#143

Post by jorblumesea » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:01 PM UTC

ev1 wrote: post #110

jorblumesea wrote: post #81

What's the argument for VPNs in 2021? Can't ISP just use metadata patterns and DPI/analytics to tell what you're up to anyways? For example if I want to hide by torrenting, it's not like VPN is going to really help that. ISP should be able to figure that out right? Or am I wrong here? edit: this is a serious question I am not trying to troll anyone here

A correct VPN will make it look like you're just sending garbage traffic to/from one destination, the outside looking in traffic pattern is completely different than a torrent directly (which is many to one + one to many)

Does it really look like garbage from the outside? My impression or understanding was that you could tease out those details (they are torrenting) but not inspect the packets directly (what are they torrenting?)

Re: NordVPN disables features when you turn off auto-renew

#144

Post by boring_twenties » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:01 PM UTC

dheera wrote: post #55

notRobot wrote: post #5

Honestly, nothing holds up to Mullvad [1]. They don't even take an email address while creating accounts, and you can pay easily with Bitcoin or even with cash mailed to them. I'm not affiliated, just a very happy customer. Mullvad is also who Mozilla trusts for the Mozilla VPN [2]. You can sign up with that if you'd like Mozilla to get a cut. [1]: https://mullvad.net/ [2]: https://vpn.mozilla.org/

I totally understand using a VPN service if you're trying to access the internet from another location, e.g. to get past the China firewall or get access to content from a different copyright jurisdiction. However, I don't fully understand the privacy argument. It would seem to be that instead of handing over your entire DNS query history and unencrypted HTTP history to your own corporate IT department or the Starbuc…

Personally if I'm going to hand over my history to someone, I'd rather it be anyone but Comcast.

Re: NordVPN disables features when you turn off auto-renew

#145

Post by upbeat_general » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:02 PM UTC

beermonster wrote: post #129

LordHeini wrote: post #7

Why are these VPNs even a thing? The only reason i would use one is to get cheaper steam keys from brasil and for that i can get a free one. From a security standpoint it is awful because you increase the number of providers you have to trust. Apart from your ISP and the server you connect to, you got a third party involved for no reason. And VPNs can not that trustworhty as shown by the leaks of logs and what not. M…

> Maybe someone can enlighten me why these services exist and what usecase they have? Because there are lots of people that can't create their own VPN even though these days you can spin up a lightsail instance for $3.50 pcm and be up and running with Wireguard in minutes. And for those people that cannot, their threat model changes to now needing to trust a single entity after they are up in minutes. As you say, tho…

Also many websites will block cloud services IPs. This can also happen with 3rd party providers but in my experience it’s much less common because some vpn providers will buy residential IPs.

It also can be nice to get a new IP more or less whenever you want by just connecting to a different, already setup server.

Re: NordVPN disables features when you turn off auto-renew

#146

Post by rochak » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:05 PM UTC

blindm wrote: post #42

I personally never liked the whole Nord ecosystem. I tried NordPass and encountered bug after bug and had to stop using it. The software seems kind of thrown together / shoddily made just to make a quick buck. They don't nearly put in as much passion and effort as better offerings like ProtonVPN and Mullvad (no affiliation, just really love their services).

Can confirm. I used to use ProtonVPN and it was worth every penny. I switched to NordVPN to save a few bucks and it was one of the worst decisions I have ever made. NordVPN couldn’t hold a candle to what ProtonVPN offered in terms of reliability, ease of use, transparency and support. ProtonVPN was costlier, but I think it justified its cost.

Re: NordVPN disables features when you turn off auto-renew

#147

Post by ev1 » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:08 PM UTC

jorblumesea wrote: post #143

ev1 wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A correct VPN will make it look like you're just sending garbage traffic to/from one destination, the outside looking in traffic pattern is completely different than a torrent directly (which is many to one + one to many)

Does it really look like garbage from the outside? My impression or understanding was that you could tease out those details (they are torrenting) but not inspect the packets directly (what are they torrenting?)

A proper VPN will completely encapsulate your layer 7 data, so you should not be able to tease out the fact that they are torrenting - it should more or less be an opaque stream.

With some protocols you can identify that they are sending VPN traffic to and from a destination, but that should be it, otherwise something has gone horribly wrong in a dangerous way.

Re: NordVPN disables features when you turn off auto-renew

#148

Post by isoprophlex » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:09 PM UTC

xxs wrote: post #25

isoprophlex wrote: post #4

By now these VPN providers are like toothpaste, diapers or soft drinks: completely undifferentiated between competitors, and so only able to maintain their market share by spending loads on marketing. Of course the company with most egregious dark patterns and aggressive churn dampening wins. Thankfully a tube of toothpaste doesn't allow implementing dark patterns like this... yet.

>doesn't allow implementing dark patterns like this. or does it? Call from the past "3D" tooth paste marketing, whitening agents, microplastics, multi-color squirts, same FUD "brush like a pro only with XXX". Those are just few (top of my head) of the levels marketing goes to attempt and sell toothpaste.

You are right of course... the "analogue dark patterns" are as old as advertising.

But there's more! since posting my comment, I've noticed Amazon dark-patterning a "monthly subscription on diapers" into a product description page.

Gotta chase that sweet sweet MRR

Re: NordVPN disables features when you turn off auto-renew

#149

Post by acdha » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:10 PM UTC

acct776 wrote: post #112

myrandomcomment wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not sure using your own is a good idea. Every time I was in China for the last 3 years they would quickly find and block my small startups VPN. I was able to send an email and ask someone to move it to a new IP. Now imaging you have your own setup and they block it, as well as access to the provider you used to create the VM that runs it. Using something like Nord or the like at least you know that they will kee…

You wouldn't advertise you were using your personal VPS as a VPN.

Your activity advertises that to anyone who can see the traffic. Even if you use a popular port, the traffic volume and timing easily stands out — and if you’re actually in China ask what they’d conclude from a client which does no other traffic except for that one IP/protocol/port, unlike basically every other device.

Re: NordVPN disables features when you turn off auto-renew

#150

Post by kelnos » Sat, Feb 06, 2021, 8:13 PM UTC

grishka wrote: post #128

notRobot wrote: post #5

Honestly, nothing holds up to Mullvad [1]. They don't even take an email address while creating accounts, and you can pay easily with Bitcoin or even with cash mailed to them. I'm not affiliated, just a very happy customer. Mullvad is also who Mozilla trusts for the Mozilla VPN [2]. You can sign up with that if you'd like Mozilla to get a cut. [1]: https://mullvad.net/ [2]: https://vpn.mozilla.org/

You can't use any commercial VPN service and expect privacy. Those are only good for bypassing geographical restrictions. If you want privacy, buy a VDS and host your own VPN server. It'll cost about the same, and you can use it for other things at no additional cost.

Seems like it'd be easier to "unmask" someone's VPS account than figure out who someone is when they use a paid VPN service.

If you're worried about a government, your personal info from a VPS provider is just one court order away. If you use a VPN service that actually is serious about not keeping PII or logs, you might fare better there (they might be coerced to log future traffic of yours, but at least your prior activity is still secret).

If you're worried about ad tracking, a VPN just doesn't do you much good period: ad tracking is sophisticated enough to not care about your IP address.

But all of this "VPN for privacy" stuff is predicated on trusting faceless third-parties to help keep you safe, so it's generally a losing proposition. Agree that the only "safe" thing to use a commercial VPN for is to bypass geographical restrictions.