How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company • Hacker News Board

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#31

Post by prodigal_erik » Tue, May 31, 2011, 8:55 PM UTC

Mizza wrote: post #26

Is anybody else slightly disturbed by all of the 'attaboy!' comments here on a post exposing unscrupulous and probably illegal business tactics? Think the response here would be the same if it was MicroSoft or the RIAA caught in something like this and not a YC alum? Anyway, great investigation and great analysis here, I think.

This. I used to think they were clever, but now we know they're such repellent scumbags willing to abuse public resources for private gain that it's actually a black mark against Y Combinator to have been partly responsible and holding dirty money.

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#32

Post by kcurtin » Tue, May 31, 2011, 9:08 PM UTC

aresant wrote: post #5

"It is a story of pure unadulterated hustle. And I love it." - Fred Wilson talking about the AirBNB team's Obama cereal hustle. I'd like to borrow his words in regard to this post. Fred's original post - http://www.avc.com/a_vc/2011/03/airbnb.html

definitely not "hustle". Sorry.

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#33

Post by windsurfer » Tue, May 31, 2011, 9:08 PM UTC

allanscu wrote: post #2

Good research. I don't think this is anything new. I'm familiar with a few YC companies that use CL as a method to get their supply (in this case vacation rentals).

This is unethical.

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#34

Post by calbear81 » Tue, May 31, 2011, 9:08 PM UTC

Mizza wrote: post #26

Is anybody else slightly disturbed by all of the 'attaboy!' comments here on a post exposing unscrupulous and probably illegal business tactics? Think the response here would be the same if it was MicroSoft or the RIAA caught in something like this and not a YC alum? Anyway, great investigation and great analysis here, I think.

I am slightly disturbed. I don't mind startups using Craigslist to market and heck, they might even be allowed to do this if they have an option on AirBnB to "market my property on my behalf" to just post the properties on CL every two weeks but what bothers me is this:

1) They explicitly violated the posters request to not receive "commercial" mail of any kind. This is basically the same thing as SPAMing. Would HN condone any type of unsolicited SPAM from a YC startup? I think not. The intent of the poster was to receive only credible inquiries from people interested in renting their property, not from competing services or people wanting to sell them on services, etc.

2) They tried to hide the fact that it was SPAM by using fake Gmail aliases and pretending to be normal folk just trying to help that vacation rental owner out. If you're going to push your service out there to people, be transparent about who you are and allow people to tell you to not contact them anymore.

I think startups are held to a looser standard and of course we all love to be "hustlers" but the idea that this behavior should be applauded regardless of it's ethnical nature seems wrong.

The analysis seemed to be from 2009, perhaps things are much different now.

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#35

Post by pgroves » Tue, May 31, 2011, 9:10 PM UTC

I started my own company to get away from the do-anything-for-a-sale attitude of corporate america. I do not admire or respect AirBnb for this behavior. I don't care that it worked. I don't care if it was legal or not, it was dishonest. I know it's common, but it takes a fundamental lack of respect to lie directly to another human being.

I'll just continue to toil in obscurity; self-respect intact.

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#36

Post by orenmazor » Tue, May 31, 2011, 9:11 PM UTC

windsurfer wrote: post #33

allanscu wrote: post #2

Good research. I don't think this is anything new. I'm familiar with a few YC companies that use CL as a method to get their supply (in this case vacation rentals).

This is unethical.

though successful.

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#37

Post by thomasgerbe » Tue, May 31, 2011, 9:25 PM UTC

MatthewB wrote: post #6

I love this. Being scrappy is one of the best qualities among entrepreneurs. The attitude of "do anything" to succeed usually results in success not to mention it is one of the characteristics that PG looks for in founders.

"I love this."

Really? Personally, I hate spam.

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#38

Post by rorrr » Tue, May 31, 2011, 9:36 PM UTC

orenmazor wrote: post #24

The author uses the term "black hat" way too much and very loosely.

Spam is black hat.

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#39

Post by pbreit » Tue, May 31, 2011, 9:39 PM UTC

helium wrote: post #12

rvanniekerk wrote: post #3

Good read, although, I wouldn't necessarily consider advertising your services to people already listing vacation rentals as "blackhat". Blackhat insinuates that someone is being gamed, in this case, both the home owners and AirBnB are benefiting (maybe craigslist is losing out?).

Of course it's blackhat. They're sending unsolicited, automated spam to people who explicitly stated that they didn't want emails regarding commercial interests. There is a big difference between advertising and spam.

"explicitly stated" = "did not change the default"

Re: How AirBnB Became a Billion Dollar Company

#40

Post by buildorfail » Tue, May 31, 2011, 9:41 PM UTC

I do not want to argue if this type of stuff is good or bad. But I do want to point out to you all that list of tech gods is full of similar stories. Off the top of my head:

MySpace started out purely through spam...Tim Ferris started out in online supplement sales...People complained about Plaxo doing black hat stuff... they sold ok. People complained about Zynga ripping off other games and about breaking every Facebook platform rule there was... look at Mark Pincus now. People complained about Facebook's Mark Zuckerberg stealing their idea... he does not care.