Program teaches prisoners coding so they can land tech jobs once released • Hacker News Board

Re: Program teaches prisoners coding so they can land tech jobs once released

#21

Post by echlebek » Fri, Feb 05, 2021, 6:17 PM UTC

lldbg wrote: post #12

underseacables wrote: post #6

In 2011-2014 I taught English and mathematics as a volunteer in a prison, and unless you’ve been there, nothing can prepare you for how truly awful America’s prison system is. The federal system is a little better, but when you get down to state prisons it gets exponentially worse. In my humble opinion, we have a vengeance and retribution mentality towards prisons in this country, when we should have a rehabilitation…

I think that retribution, which is of course the principal component of justice, is a key part of prisons. Somewhere the scales must be balanced, and if not in prisons, where then? Should the assaulted be happy with the fact that the inmate will get a job? That is not to say that prisons should be blind to the fact that inmates will eventually be released. There are plenty of people who have committed no crime, but g…

> I think that retribution, which is of course the principal component of justice

That ain't necessarily so, and not every penal system has that philosophy. If prisons turn out people who are unemployable, they will simply keep doing whatever they can do to make a living. If lawful society doesn't take them, someone else will. Justice has to work at the societal level.

Re: Program teaches prisoners coding so they can land tech jobs once released

#22

Post by [deleted] » Fri, Feb 05, 2021, 6:18 PM UTC

hn8788 wrote: post #13

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>the country’s 83 percent recidivism rate Holy shizz, that's a lot. It's as if US laws and prisons aren't there to rehabilitate an individual but to turn him against society for good, making him a returning "customer" so that certain interest groups can keep profiting. But that's just probably my imagination running wild.

One theory I've heard is that for some particularly bad areas, Baltimore for example, the purpose is to keep people off the street for as long as possible to give young people a chance to grow up without seeing crime as a viable career choice. The idea being that some neigbhorhoods are too far gone, and rehabilitation won't work when people will be released from prison back into crime infested neighborhoods. Whether…

[deleted]

Re: Program teaches prisoners coding so they can land tech jobs once released

#23

Post by titzer » Fri, Feb 05, 2021, 6:20 PM UTC

lldbg wrote: post #12

underseacables wrote: post #6

In 2011-2014 I taught English and mathematics as a volunteer in a prison, and unless you’ve been there, nothing can prepare you for how truly awful America’s prison system is. The federal system is a little better, but when you get down to state prisons it gets exponentially worse. In my humble opinion, we have a vengeance and retribution mentality towards prisons in this country, when we should have a rehabilitation…

I think that retribution, which is of course the principal component of justice, is a key part of prisons. Somewhere the scales must be balanced, and if not in prisons, where then? Should the assaulted be happy with the fact that the inmate will get a job? That is not to say that prisons should be blind to the fact that inmates will eventually be released. There are plenty of people who have committed no crime, but g…

I can't think of anything more cruel and worse for society as a whole than to permanently damage some people because it feels vaguely cathartic and might serve as a "warning" to others.

Re: Program teaches prisoners coding so they can land tech jobs once released

#24

Post by WrtCdEvrydy » Fri, Feb 05, 2021, 6:22 PM UTC

sokoloff wrote: post #10

dudul wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good luck with that unfortunately. I can't remember the last time I joined a company that didn't run a background check on me.

Running a background check doesn’t mean you can’t accept certain negative content in that background. A background check produces information not a decision .

Usually a background check just means a credit check.

Re: Program teaches prisoners coding so they can land tech jobs once released

#25

Post by xiphias2 » Fri, Feb 05, 2021, 6:22 PM UTC

Guest42 wrote: post #11

Entry level tech jobs are remarkably scarce and difficult to obtain/maintain. Even with a masters and experience it takes 100+ applications. Most companies don’t hire programmers and the ones that do often contract it out overseas. I know there are caveats and counter-anecdotes but this has been my set of observations over the last 10 years.

It's because the 10x engineer is real: many people learn coding just for earning money, not like 20 years ago when most people did it out of passion. This means that there are more people that can't provide enough business value to be justified in a tech company.

At the same time they can use their coding skills to make non-tech office jobs more automated.

Re: Program teaches prisoners coding so they can land tech jobs once released

#26

Post by giarc » Fri, Feb 05, 2021, 6:23 PM UTC

underseacables wrote: post #6

In 2011-2014 I taught English and mathematics as a volunteer in a prison, and unless you’ve been there, nothing can prepare you for how truly awful America’s prison system is. The federal system is a little better, but when you get down to state prisons it gets exponentially worse. In my humble opinion, we have a vengeance and retribution mentality towards prisons in this country, when we should have a rehabilitation…

My grandfather and my high school science teacher both taught in youth "detention centres" for periods in their career. They both said students there were better behaved than regular schools. For the "inmates" (for lack of better term), school was a privilege and if they misbehaved, they couldn't attend. School was a good break from your cell/room.

Re: Program teaches prisoners coding so they can land tech jobs once released

#27

Post by rendall » Fri, Feb 05, 2021, 6:23 PM UTC

lldbg wrote: post #12

underseacables wrote: post #6

In 2011-2014 I taught English and mathematics as a volunteer in a prison, and unless you’ve been there, nothing can prepare you for how truly awful America’s prison system is. The federal system is a little better, but when you get down to state prisons it gets exponentially worse. In my humble opinion, we have a vengeance and retribution mentality towards prisons in this country, when we should have a rehabilitation…

I think that retribution, which is of course the principal component of justice, is a key part of prisons. Somewhere the scales must be balanced, and if not in prisons, where then? Should the assaulted be happy with the fact that the inmate will get a job? That is not to say that prisons should be blind to the fact that inmates will eventually be released. There are plenty of people who have committed no crime, but g…

> Should the assaulted be happy with the fact that the inmate will get a job?

Heck yeah! If civil penalties have been assessed, how else are they going to get paid?

Crazy how most Americans think even the smallest crime should mean life in prison plus anal rape

Re: Program teaches prisoners coding so they can land tech jobs once released

#28

Post by sokoloff » Fri, Feb 05, 2021, 6:24 PM UTC

Guest42 wrote: post #11

Entry level tech jobs are remarkably scarce and difficult to obtain/maintain. Even with a masters and experience it takes 100+ applications. Most companies don’t hire programmers and the ones that do often contract it out overseas. I know there are caveats and counter-anecdotes but this has been my set of observations over the last 10 years.

When I look over the interview and coding exercise results from entry-level applicants, I can understand how some of the candidates will apply and interview a lot before landing a role. There’s a pretty sharp clustering into “can very likely code” and “did not demonstrate they could productively code”.

Re: Program teaches prisoners coding so they can land tech jobs once released

#29

Post by tluyben2 » Fri, Feb 05, 2021, 6:24 PM UTC

llarsson wrote: post #3

Great initiative! Hopefully employers will not overlook these candidates because of their criminal record.

I guess if they are significantly cheaper than others, people will hire them. There is a long way to $0 from the salaries people on HN say developers make in the US. I do not know any convicted people, however, I do know jobless people who were 'made redundant' by covid or before that and they would work for very little (enough to get by, but not more than that) if they could work from home as developer. I bet that goes for many people including ex convicts.

Re: Program teaches prisoners coding so they can land tech jobs once released

#30

Post by bryanrasmussen » Fri, Feb 05, 2021, 6:26 PM UTC

lldbg wrote: post #12

underseacables wrote: post #6

In 2011-2014 I taught English and mathematics as a volunteer in a prison, and unless you’ve been there, nothing can prepare you for how truly awful America’s prison system is. The federal system is a little better, but when you get down to state prisons it gets exponentially worse. In my humble opinion, we have a vengeance and retribution mentality towards prisons in this country, when we should have a rehabilitation…

I think that retribution, which is of course the principal component of justice, is a key part of prisons. Somewhere the scales must be balanced, and if not in prisons, where then? Should the assaulted be happy with the fact that the inmate will get a job? That is not to say that prisons should be blind to the fact that inmates will eventually be released. There are plenty of people who have committed no crime, but g…

>Should the assaulted be happy with the fact that the inmate will get a job?

It was not until now that I came to realize that everyone in American prisons are actually there for assault. The mind reels.