Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Apollo 14 50th anniversary images find Alan Shepard's ball and how far he hit it

bbc.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

101–110 of 122 posts

Re: Apollo 14 50th anniversary images find Alan Shepard's ball and how far he hit it

#101

Post by jtxxwl2 »

jonfw wrote: post #100
jtxxwl2 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, lots of bread and circuses. Are they healthy? Are their grandchildren and great-grandchildren going to inherit a civilization that they would want to be born in to?

If a dog is fat it's somebody else's fault, if a person is fat it's their fault. > Are their grandchildren and great-grandchildren going to inherit a civilization that they would want to be born in to? How should I know how people's unborn children feel about a society which doesn't exist yet?

>If a dog is fat it's somebody else's fault, if a person is fat it's their fault.

I don't really care whom you blame, I care about the results. Our society could do much more to stop people from being fat and unhealthy, yet 70% of the country is overweight, and more people have chronic health problems than don't.

>How should I know how people's unborn children feel about a society which doesn't exist yet?

I'm not asking how the unborn children feel, I'm asking whether the existing people would want to be born into the civilization which they expect that their grandchildren and great-grandchildren will inherit.

Re: Apollo 14 50th anniversary images find Alan Shepard's ball and how far he hit it

#102

Post by jonfw »

jtxxwl2 wrote: post #101
jonfw wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a dog is fat it's somebody else's fault, if a person is fat it's their fault. > Are their grandchildren and great-grandchildren going to inherit a civilization that they would want to be born in to? How should I know how people's unborn children feel about a society which doesn't exist yet?

>If a dog is fat it's somebody else's fault, if a person is fat it's their fault. I don't really care whom you blame, I care about the results. Our society could do much more to stop people from being fat and unhealthy, yet 70% of the country is overweight, and more people have chronic health problems than don't. >How should I know how people's unborn children feel about a society which doesn't exist yet? I'm not ask…

> don't really care whom you blame, I care about the results. Our society could do much more to stop people from being fat and unhealthy, yet 70% of the country is overweight, and more people have chronic health problems than don't.

Unless you want members of society to walk around smacking soda and fried potato products out of people's hands, I'm not sure that I agree.

If we want to pool our resources as a people to solve problems for others, let's start with water scarcity, unstable/oppressive governments, and renewable energy. Please don't sign me up for forcing people onto weight watchers plans.

Re: Apollo 14 50th anniversary images find Alan Shepard's ball and how far he hit it

#103

Post by jtxxwl2 »

jamestimmins wrote: post #54
ryandrake wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know if this dean's observation is about helicopter parenting or risk aversion as much as it's about how bifurcated and ultra-high stakes the university/credential-pedigree system has become, and how essential it is to optimize for a certain outcome at all costs. When I was high school age, the A students went to good universities and generally ended up with a good professional career, the B students went to…

I understand your point, but don't think the Walmart/Meth comparison is fair. Walmart is full of hardworking people doing honorable work that provides for their families and contributes to their communities.

Is working for Walmart something you would aspire for your grandchildren to be doing as a career?

Re: Apollo 14 50th anniversary images find Alan Shepard's ball and how far he hit it

#104

Post by ryandrake »

refurb wrote: post #65
ryandrake wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed--not making them equivalent. It's a deliberately wide spectrum for folks with few opportunities. The overall point is that what the dean perceived as risk aversion may instead be the chilling effect of the growing lack of opportunity for all but the top 1% of the next few generations. If people want to nit pick about two words, I can't stop them.

What you said is horribly offensive and pretty eye opening about how you see the lives of middle and lower class Americans. There are plenty of hard working, proud Americans of all races who never go to a fancy school or maybe never go to college at all, yet the have good paying jobs (maybe not good paying to you), live in good neighborhoods (again, probably ones you look down on), raise respectable kids who are kind…

Wow, I don't know what brush you're trying to paint me with but it's the wrong one. I'm one of those B-C students who, through luck of when I was born, managed to grab a tiny bit of upward mobility and cobble together an OK middle-of-the-road life. No Ivy League track for me. If I was born today and took the same path, I'd probably be struggling a lot due to how bifurcated and winner-take-all things are getting. I look around today and am very worried that my child and her generation will not have any opportunities unless they're valedictorian. Those good paying jobs you talk about are good, but they're disappearing rapidly.

Re: Apollo 14 50th anniversary images find Alan Shepard's ball and how far he hit it

#105

Post by jtxxwl2 »

jonfw wrote: post #102
jtxxwl2 wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>If a dog is fat it's somebody else's fault, if a person is fat it's their fault. I don't really care whom you blame, I care about the results. Our society could do much more to stop people from being fat and unhealthy, yet 70% of the country is overweight, and more people have chronic health problems than don't. >How should I know how people's unborn children feel about a society which doesn't exist yet? I'm not ask…

> don't really care whom you blame, I care about the results. Our society could do much more to stop people from being fat and unhealthy, yet 70% of the country is overweight, and more people have chronic health problems than don't. Unless you want members of society to walk around smacking soda and fried potato products out of people's hands, I'm not sure that I agree. If we want to pool our resources as a people to…

How about locking the soda and sugary snacks away with the cigarettes, instead of having them in your face (and your children's faces) in the checkout aisle? How about putting warning labels on them like cigarette cartons instead of cartoon pictures designed to get the attention of children?

How about devoting multiple hours of every school day in high school to getting students into great shape, so they don't start off their adult lives overweight?

There are many, many things we could easily do, but the people who run our civilization do not want them to be done. Those same people are the ones that are gaining more and more power over the people, by the way, as a consequence of the concentration of wealth.

What water scarcity problem is currently causing problems for 70% of the country?

Re: Apollo 14 50th anniversary images find Alan Shepard's ball and how far he hit it

#106

Post by jjk166 »

mattmanser wrote: post #96
kortilla wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the A students maybe will finish college hamstrung with mountains of debt, and the rest? Walmart/Meth if they're lucky, prison if they're not. This is the false dichotomy that’s causing students to incorrectly go to college when it might not be the best path. There is a massive gulf of the middle class you just glossed over between college and Walmart/meth: the trades. Working in skilled blue collar fields (electri…

I've seen it said a few times that there's a reason why electricians, contractors, plumbers, diesel mechanics, etc send their kids to college and it's because all those trades are hard on your body and a bit dangerous. Yes they are a route to financial independence, but there's a hidden cost that a banker, marketer, SEO expert, programmer, manager, etc. does not have to pay.

In manual labor you get physically tired, your joints grow steadily more achy, your run the risk of injury - obviously it's unpleasant.

In mental labor you get fat and achy sitting at a desk all day, your sleep schedule gets messed up looking at artificial light constantly, your mental health degrades and your risk of suicide increases - obviously it's also unpleasant.

We can all agree the manual laborer's job is hard because no one can really escape manual labor. Even if your profession doesn't require you to lift a finger, other things in life like taking care of a home expose us to plenty of comparable tasks, and we can easily imagine how much worse it would be to do these tasks all the time. But the manual laborer can forego most of the negatives of office work which require prolonged and continuous exposure to things we would never experience in nature. Thus the manual laborer tends to see greener grass on the other side while the office worker does not.

Re: Apollo 14 50th anniversary images find Alan Shepard's ball and how far he hit it

#107

Post by jonfw »

jtxxwl2 wrote: post #105
jonfw wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> don't really care whom you blame, I care about the results. Our society could do much more to stop people from being fat and unhealthy, yet 70% of the country is overweight, and more people have chronic health problems than don't. Unless you want members of society to walk around smacking soda and fried potato products out of people's hands, I'm not sure that I agree. If we want to pool our resources as a people to…

How about locking the soda and sugary snacks away with the cigarettes, instead of having them in your face (and your children's faces) in the checkout aisle? How about putting warning labels on them like cigarette cartons instead of cartoon pictures designed to get the attention of children? How about devoting multiple hours of every school day in high school to getting students into great shape, so they don't start…

The root of the problem is a lack of self control, and putting things in scarier packaging will not solve that problem. It's sort of like distributing tissues as a solution to the COVID pandemic, it's just addressing a symptom.

Why would we restrict our charity to this country? Let's solve real problems, which mostly exist in other countries. Unrestricted access to soda and Twinkies is not a real problem.

In addition, prohibition does not work. It doesn't work with alcohol, it doesn't work with drugs, it doesn't work with gambling, and it won't work with cake.

Re: Apollo 14 50th anniversary images find Alan Shepard's ball and how far he hit it

#108

Post by johncessna »

mattmanser wrote: post #96
kortilla wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the A students maybe will finish college hamstrung with mountains of debt, and the rest? Walmart/Meth if they're lucky, prison if they're not. This is the false dichotomy that’s causing students to incorrectly go to college when it might not be the best path. There is a massive gulf of the middle class you just glossed over between college and Walmart/meth: the trades. Working in skilled blue collar fields (electri…

I've seen it said a few times that there's a reason why electricians, contractors, plumbers, diesel mechanics, etc send their kids to college and it's because all those trades are hard on your body and a bit dangerous. Yes they are a route to financial independence, but there's a hidden cost that a banker, marketer, SEO expert, programmer, manager, etc. does not have to pay.

I'm sure they fall into the same trap that college == success.

The trades are excellent careers. The issue is see with those careers is that people in the trades don't look ahead. No one wants to haul roofing shingles at 45 or crawling under houses at 50. A master of their trade commands a high hourly rate and should be looking at teaching opportunities, running their own shop opportunities, safety opportunities, or general project overview.

Re: Apollo 14 50th anniversary images find Alan Shepard's ball and how far he hit it

#109

Post by jtxxwl2 »

jonfw wrote: post #107
jtxxwl2 wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about locking the soda and sugary snacks away with the cigarettes, instead of having them in your face (and your children's faces) in the checkout aisle? How about putting warning labels on them like cigarette cartons instead of cartoon pictures designed to get the attention of children? How about devoting multiple hours of every school day in high school to getting students into great shape, so they don't start…

The root of the problem is a lack of self control, and putting things in scarier packaging will not solve that problem. It's sort of like distributing tissues as a solution to the COVID pandemic, it's just addressing a symptom. Why would we restrict our charity to this country? Let's solve real problems, which mostly exist in other countries. Unrestricted access to soda and Twinkies is not a real problem. In addition…

>The root of the problem is a lack of self control

So make it easier for people to control their own behavior, if you want to make a dent in the problem. Teach them how to be in good shape by actually making them do it as adolescents. Teenagers are already required to participate in gym class. Why don't we change gym class so that it actually does something for them?

>and putting things in scarier packaging will not solve that problem.

Do you think that the labeling on a package is irrelevant? Then why do companies spend so much money designing it? Why are they all bright flashy colors, rather than black, white, and grey?

>Why would we restrict our charity to this country?

Because this is where we live, and where our families live, and the quality of their lives is most dependent on what happens to the people here.

>Let's solve real problems, which mostly exist in other countries. Unrestricted access to soda and Twinkies is not a real problem.

70% of the country being overweight is a real problem.

>In addition, prohibition does not work.

I said nothing about prohibition. Having to ask the cashier to go get you your case of Pepsi is not the same as banning the sale of Pepsi.

Re: Apollo 14 50th anniversary images find Alan Shepard's ball and how far he hit it

#110

Post by jjk166 »

hedora wrote: post #12
jamestimmins wrote: post #9

I wonder if things like this would ever happen now. The original Mercury and Apollo astronauts were Air Force test pilots, a group known for picking and choosing which rules they wanted to follow. Sneaking a golf club aboard, not to mention the possibility of falling and tearing his suit, is a non-trivial risk. It's hard to imagine that culture of risk taking still exists, but at the same time, that culture may be wh…

Your comment reminds me of this book: https://time.com/3910020/the-over-parenting-trap-how-to-avoi... > So imagine how surprised I was to discover among my more affluent, well-connected students a growing number who seemed to be lacking the ability to make their way independently in the world, as, frankly, 18-22 year olds always had been able to do and just as crucially, used to desire to do. I’m deliberately being v…

Personally I think the risk aversion has less to do with parenting and more just life experience. For the vast majority of human existence, high child mortality was much higher than today. Even for the wealthiest, watching some of your siblings die was simply a fact of life. It was only in the early 20th century that childhood death became uncommon, and even then these kids were being born to and raised by people who had grown up in such a world. My grandfather, for example, was the youngest of 12 and grew up in a household where no one expected all 12 to make it. The combination of an excessively large number of people and the desensitization to death (with maybe a little bit of lead paint thrown in for good measure) naturally leads to the view of life being cheap. These are the sorts of conditions that make wars that cost tens of millions of lives conceivable, but also the conditions where people are okay with being strapped to a rocket with only a bit of testing. The baby boomers were really the first generation raised entirely with the expectation that they would live, and late genX/early millennial children were likely the first in history to be raised by parents who had been raised with that mindset. The longer you expect to live, the more sensible risk aversion is.
Post reply on HN