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Disqus, a dark commenting system

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Re: Disqus, a dark commenting system

#101

Post by tleb_ »

CaptArmchair wrote: post #37

I've been around long enough to have seen how comments on the Web emerged from innocuous guest books and a feature in personal blogging and ended up being un-ironically slapped to any 5-line piece of content. Disqus and their ilk exist because of one reason only: convenience. (a) You don't need to install software and a database to store comments, (b) you don't need to maintain that software or worry that it's an att…

> In fact, the GDPR has also made it harder to slap a comment box on your website in general. The moment you do, you are now considered a data controller. And visitors can demand that you provide them with insights in how you manage their comments.

Not if you don't store any personal data ("any information relating to an identified or identifiable natural person" as per the GDPR). If you just provide pseudonym and message fields, you have no issue. This is in the spirit of "data minimisation".

The other alternative is of course to remove the comment box and provide some contact info. Works well but people might not be as keen on sending something.

Re: Disqus, a dark commenting system

#102

Post by camehere3saydis »

markessien wrote: post #81
throw14082020 wrote: post #47

The author of the post runs a competitor called Hyvor Talk (he discloses this at the end). I've had hyvor talk for more than a year. I don't run a blog thats very popular, but it has been quite easy to integrate (I use React, Gatsby/ static side generation, and Hyvor Talk has a react component). An example of the system is at the bottom of that blog post. There used to be a free tier, but now there isn't. I am only s…

Try remark42. Free, open source.

But self-host only, unless there's also a free remark42-as-a-Service?

Re: Disqus, a dark commenting system

#103

Post by hnra »

dmos62 wrote: post #100
xfz wrote: post #94

Title should probably have [Advert] prefix or something. That said, I deleted my Disqus account as part of a general cleanup and I'm glad I did. The web needs to shift more to a model where people pay openly for services; ideally with micropayments or a Spotify-like subscription to ensure a large user base. Free products are ok as a gateway to the paid product, but not if the business model relies on selling data (ei…

Spotify relies on monopolizing your listening data. You should avoid it on the same premise. Delivering music is easy; their unique offering is the recommendation engine. There's no competition because there's no open listening data. If we could make it open, then you could have actual competition in the space (coincidentlly Spotify recommendations aren't great at the moment).

Does any other service deliver music and podcasts at a much lower price then?

Re: Disqus, a dark commenting system

#104

Post by Nextgrid »

spinningslate wrote: post #70
throw14082020 wrote: post #47

The author of the post runs a competitor called Hyvor Talk (he discloses this at the end). I've had hyvor talk for more than a year. I don't run a blog thats very popular, but it has been quite easy to integrate (I use React, Gatsby/ static side generation, and Hyvor Talk has a react component). An example of the system is at the bottom of that blog post. There used to be a free tier, but now there isn't. I am only s…

I'm conflicted about the free tier thing. On the one hand, I get that personal/non-commercial sites don't generate revenue - so shelling out for a comment system is unattractive. On the other hand: the whole reason that shady, dark pattern, privacy killers like disqus exist is because people won't pay for stuff. It's at least partly cultural. We'll pay for hosting, or internet access. Why won't we pay for other servi…

"Free" can't indeed be put back in its cage, but this would also apply to real-life, and yet the majority of people don't go out stealing/robbing people even though it would technically allow them to get goods for free that they otherwise would need to pay for.

The problem isn't advertising in itself. The problem is that the law hasn't caught up (or doesn't want to catch up, thanks to corruption/lobbying by vested interests) with cracking down on large-scale non-consensual data collection (which we used to call spyware).

Ads are fine. The problem is that apparently ads don't pay enough and the advertising/data collection industry is engaging in unethical and potentially illegal practices of large-scale stalking (without informed consent) to try and get extra money.

Re: Disqus, a dark commenting system

#105

Post by sofixa »

spinningslate wrote: post #70
throw14082020 wrote: post #47

The author of the post runs a competitor called Hyvor Talk (he discloses this at the end). I've had hyvor talk for more than a year. I don't run a blog thats very popular, but it has been quite easy to integrate (I use React, Gatsby/ static side generation, and Hyvor Talk has a react component). An example of the system is at the bottom of that blog post. There used to be a free tier, but now there isn't. I am only s…

I'm conflicted about the free tier thing. On the one hand, I get that personal/non-commercial sites don't generate revenue - so shelling out for a comment system is unattractive. On the other hand: the whole reason that shady, dark pattern, privacy killers like disqus exist is because people won't pay for stuff. It's at least partly cultural. We'll pay for hosting, or internet access. Why won't we pay for other servi…

> We'll pay for hosting

Will we? Most personal websites i know of, including my own, fit perfectly within the free tiers of Netlify/Vercel/Firebase/S3+CloudFront/GitHub Pages/etc.

Re: Disqus, a dark commenting system

#106

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

Once, a number of years ago (Disqus has been around a while), I signed up for a Disqus account.

As part of the process, the service showed me a page of comments from around the Web, and asked if they were mine, and, if so, would I like to associate them with the account.

I was horrified. They included some...rather “rash” comments that I had made, over the years (I was not always the stuffy boomer that I am now). Many were quite old, and, I had thought, made anonymously.

I scragged the process immediately, and made a vow to be a good boy, from then on (I had already made that choice, years earlier, but this solidified it).

Nowadays, I deliberately associate myself with my online comments. I nuked my last anonymous account years ago.

It is my opinion that anonymity is an illusion, these days. I feel that knowing my words can come back to haunt me, helps me to be more careful in what I say; just like in real life.

Re: Disqus, a dark commenting system

#107

Post by sofixa »

hnra wrote: post #103
dmos62 wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Spotify relies on monopolizing your listening data. You should avoid it on the same premise. Delivering music is easy; their unique offering is the recommendation engine. There's no competition because there's no open listening data. If we could make it open, then you could have actual competition in the space (coincidentlly Spotify recommendations aren't great at the moment).

Does any other service deliver music and podcasts at a much lower price then?

Plenty of alternatives exist - YouTube Premium ( which also gets you YouTube with no adds, on top of YouTube Music), Amazon Music, Apple Music, and iirc pandora, SoundCloud? I haven't compared prices.

Re: Disqus, a dark commenting system

#108

Post by duckmysick »

pmlnr wrote: post #51
alexgmcm wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I think the problem with self-hosting vs. Medium is that it is harder for the authors to reach a large audience. I mean, even if you don't want to make money from your cool project or tutorial or whatever, you still want people to see it. But man, I really hate Medium.

> Yeah, I think the problem with self-hosting vs. Medium is that it is harder for the authors to reach a large audience. To be honest, this sounds like profit thinking as well. Why would one need "wide audience" when it's about their interest and hobbies? They need sincere search engines, that's all.

Some people are proud of their work and they want to show it to others. The more people see it and appreciate it, the more validated and important the creators feel.

It's like sending invitations to your birthday party. It feels bad when just one person shows up.

> They need sincere search engines, that's all.

What exactly are you suggesting to the content creators?

Re: Disqus, a dark commenting system

#109

Post by stonesweep »

hnra wrote: post #103
dmos62 wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Spotify relies on monopolizing your listening data. You should avoid it on the same premise. Delivering music is easy; their unique offering is the recommendation engine. There's no competition because there's no open listening data. If we could make it open, then you could have actual competition in the space (coincidentlly Spotify recommendations aren't great at the moment).

Does any other service deliver music and podcasts at a much lower price then?

Shoutcast/Icecast are alive and well, there are thousands of independent radio stations online; one of the most well known (SomaFM) is alive and well, ad free listener supported. Big Sonic Heaven is still online, both of these are like 20 years and running.

Lots of podcasts are free from their source, Spotify doesn't even offer one of favorite ones (a weekly DJ mix, 500+ episodes strong) all you need is an app like AntennaPod (Android).

Re: Disqus, a dark commenting system

#110

Post by tinus_hn »

sofixa wrote: post #105
spinningslate wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm conflicted about the free tier thing. On the one hand, I get that personal/non-commercial sites don't generate revenue - so shelling out for a comment system is unattractive. On the other hand: the whole reason that shady, dark pattern, privacy killers like disqus exist is because people won't pay for stuff. It's at least partly cultural. We'll pay for hosting, or internet access. Why won't we pay for other servi…

> We'll pay for hosting Will we? Most personal websites i know of, including my own, fit perfectly within the free tiers of Netlify/Vercel/Firebase/S3+CloudFront/GitHub Pages/etc.

The cost of a commenting system is not in hosting, it’s in moderation.
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