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Amazon shortchanged drivers $61.7M in tips

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Amazon shortchanged drivers $61.7M in tips

#211

Post by ornornor »

bigmattystyles wrote: post #182
ben509 wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tips are fundamentally broken. If you didn't know about tips, and someone offered you a job and said, "I'll pay you crap wages, but you can ask the customers for more money. Don't worry, they'll pay or their friends won't like them," you'd think it was a scam because it's such an obviously terrible deal. Tips are an awful way to incentivize good service. I'm neither qualified to judge my server's performance, and I'v…

It’s even worse, in most places, tips are pooled and split evenly from what’s left over after you as the waiter tip out the bussers, bartenders, etc.. It makes for awful office politics.

Tips even go to the manager and owner very often.

Re: Amazon shortchanged drivers $61.7M in tips

#212

Post by abandonliberty »

emptysongglass wrote: post #209
ben509 wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tips are fundamentally broken. If you didn't know about tips, and someone offered you a job and said, "I'll pay you crap wages, but you can ask the customers for more money. Don't worry, they'll pay or their friends won't like them," you'd think it was a scam because it's such an obviously terrible deal. Tips are an awful way to incentivize good service. I'm neither qualified to judge my server's performance, and I'v…

Can we talk about why service is astronomically better in the US than countries with very high worker protections and base wages like Denmark? I'm genuinely curious what you think the factors are in their difference because when I live in Denmark (as I do now) it feels like the waiter could give less of a s** whether the service is good or not whereas when I live in LA or NYC I feel like I am the golden child of thei…

It's cultural. You can get amazing service in other countries with little or no tipping culture.

Sure, tipping may be an incentive as well, but most people I know won't go below 10% even if the service is terrible.

Re: Amazon shortchanged drivers $61.7M in tips

#213

Post by Cthulhu_ »

imgabe wrote: post #9

Just do away with tips. It's a terrible and stupid system. If you want to do it as a customer, go ahead, but it should never be considered as part of the employee's compensation. If people aren't willing to do the job for the hourly wage alone with no tips, raise the wage until they are.

Consumers / customers should also be on board with this though; there are plenty of experiments in e.g. the service industry with a "no tips" policy, and especially the older generation has problems with it. The same type that will use low/no tips as "punishment", mind you.

Re: Amazon shortchanged drivers $61.7M in tips

#214

Post by emptysongglass »

abandonliberty wrote: post #212
emptysongglass wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can we talk about why service is astronomically better in the US than countries with very high worker protections and base wages like Denmark? I'm genuinely curious what you think the factors are in their difference because when I live in Denmark (as I do now) it feels like the waiter could give less of a s** whether the service is good or not whereas when I live in LA or NYC I feel like I am the golden child of thei…

It's cultural. You can get amazing service in other countries with little or no tipping culture. Sure, tipping may be an incentive as well, but most people I know won't go below 10% even if the service is terrible.

Which other countries with little to no tipping culture do you receive amazing service?

Again, I am curious, not combative, so please take care if applying disdain to my comments.

Re: Amazon shortchanged drivers $61.7M in tips

#215

Post by Cthulhu_ »

ARandomerDude wrote: post #153
ben509 wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tips are fundamentally broken. If you didn't know about tips, and someone offered you a job and said, "I'll pay you crap wages, but you can ask the customers for more money. Don't worry, they'll pay or their friends won't like them," you'd think it was a scam because it's such an obviously terrible deal. Tips are an awful way to incentivize good service. I'm neither qualified to judge my server's performance, and I'v…

You're absolutely right, given the premise that we tip to incentivize good service. In reality, we tip so businesses can advertise an $18 meal for $14.99.

And also so that customers can dangle a tip in front of an underpaid, overworked employee, only to snatch it away if they don't smile or go to church or insert some arbitrary reason here. It's both consumers and employers who keep the tipping culture and its toxicity alive.

I mean the one time I was in the US having breakfast or lunch at some random place. They had at least five staff milling around for twenty-five customers, probably more (staff I mean). You don't need to have two teens frantically going around with pitchers of water, just plop one down on the table and pay the remaining employees a good wage.

A good wage is not minimum wage either. Minimum wage is a "what is the least I can legally pay this employee", while as an employer your mindset should be "how much is this employee worth and how can I make them feel appreciated"

Re: Amazon shortchanged drivers $61.7M in tips

#216

Post by isbvhodnvemrwvn »

abandonliberty wrote: post #212
emptysongglass wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can we talk about why service is astronomically better in the US than countries with very high worker protections and base wages like Denmark? I'm genuinely curious what you think the factors are in their difference because when I live in Denmark (as I do now) it feels like the waiter could give less of a s** whether the service is good or not whereas when I live in LA or NYC I feel like I am the golden child of thei…

It's cultural. You can get amazing service in other countries with little or no tipping culture. Sure, tipping may be an incentive as well, but most people I know won't go below 10% even if the service is terrible.

The service you get in the US is very annoying to people not used to it. Fake-smiling at me especially.

Re: Amazon shortchanged drivers $61.7M in tips

#217

Post by nmca »

emptysongglass wrote: post #209
ben509 wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tips are fundamentally broken. If you didn't know about tips, and someone offered you a job and said, "I'll pay you crap wages, but you can ask the customers for more money. Don't worry, they'll pay or their friends won't like them," you'd think it was a scam because it's such an obviously terrible deal. Tips are an awful way to incentivize good service. I'm neither qualified to judge my server's performance, and I'v…

Can we talk about why service is astronomically better in the US than countries with very high worker protections and base wages like Denmark? I'm genuinely curious what you think the factors are in their difference because when I live in Denmark (as I do now) it feels like the waiter could give less of a s** whether the service is good or not whereas when I live in LA or NYC I feel like I am the golden child of thei…

An entire section of society so precariously clings to financial stability that they'll smile at at any customer's joke...

Re: Amazon shortchanged drivers $61.7M in tips

#218

Post by drewwwwww »

emptysongglass wrote: post #214
abandonliberty wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's cultural. You can get amazing service in other countries with little or no tipping culture. Sure, tipping may be an incentive as well, but most people I know won't go below 10% even if the service is terrible.

Which other countries with little to no tipping culture do you receive amazing service? Again, I am curious, not combative, so please take care if applying disdain to my comments.

japan

Re: Amazon shortchanged drivers $61.7M in tips

#219

Post by skocznymroczny »

emptysongglass wrote: post #209
ben509 wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tips are fundamentally broken. If you didn't know about tips, and someone offered you a job and said, "I'll pay you crap wages, but you can ask the customers for more money. Don't worry, they'll pay or their friends won't like them," you'd think it was a scam because it's such an obviously terrible deal. Tips are an awful way to incentivize good service. I'm neither qualified to judge my server's performance, and I'v…

Can we talk about why service is astronomically better in the US than countries with very high worker protections and base wages like Denmark? I'm genuinely curious what you think the factors are in their difference because when I live in Denmark (as I do now) it feels like the waiter could give less of a s** whether the service is good or not whereas when I live in LA or NYC I feel like I am the golden child of thei…

I think it's a very cultural aspect. In the US you have the waiters coming up to you, asking if you liked your meal, would you like something else. In Nordic countries people prefer to be left alone, which might be interpreted as not caring. If you were to go to Greece, you could be getting the same experience, with the owner himself walking around the tables and asking what you thought of the meal.

Re: Amazon shortchanged drivers $61.7M in tips

#220

Post by cheriot »

> Amazon agreed to pay the regulator $61.7 million, the amount the FTC claims the company shorted its drivers ... Law precludes the agency from additionally fining the company

WTF. The penalty is not getting to keep the stolen money? American labor law is embarrassing.

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