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Germany to be nuclear-free by 2022

reuters.com

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Re: Germany to be nuclear-free by 2022

#31

Post by Argorak »

latch wrote: post #15

Germany is a leader in solar power. They installed more panels last year than the rest of the world combined. They generate more electricity from solar than Fukushima did. If they can further establish themselves as leaders and experts in new-energy, it'll make them even more disproportionally well positioned to most of Europe. However, it's a shame they see no future in nuclear. Seems like they are betting against s…

Germany is also one of the main suppliers for regenerating power technologies. So they do have an industry branch that benefits from that move.

Re: Germany to be nuclear-free by 2022

#32

Post by hugh3 »

zhoutong wrote: post #25

That's more than 11 years to complete this task. Who can predict what will happen after 11 years? Generating electricity from nuclear fusion may be possible. Or we may move our nuclear plants to the moon. We shouldn't ignore the fact that 70% of France's energy consumption is backed by nuclear plants, and this makes France one of the cleanest country in terms of energy consumption in the world. I just don't understan…

That's more than 11 years to complete this task. Who can predict what will happen after 11 years? Generating electricity from nuclear fusion may be possible. Or we may move our nuclear plants to the moon

Or, far more likely, we'll still be burning coal.

Hey, it's no skin off my nose, I'm an Australian. If the Germans wanna quit importing our uranium and start importing our coal instead then that's cool, I just think the German greens are gonna wind up looking pretty stupid when they suddenly need to build fifty new coal power plants by 2011.

Re: Germany to be nuclear-free by 2022

#33

Post by erikb »

henrikschroder wrote: post #6

Sweden held a referendum in 1980 about nuclear power, and the only choice was about how fast our nuclear power plants should be shut down. It took twenty years until a reactor was closed, and five more years until one whole plant was closed. During this time, Sweden's energy consumption has of course gone up, and although there's been some increase in wind and water power, the net result is that each time we close a…

The funny thing is that some of the German nuclear power plants are owned by the Swedish Company Vattenfall.

Re: Germany to be nuclear-free by 2022

#35

Post by queensnake »

zhoutong wrote: post #25

That's more than 11 years to complete this task. Who can predict what will happen after 11 years? Generating electricity from nuclear fusion may be possible. Or we may move our nuclear plants to the moon. We shouldn't ignore the fact that 70% of France's energy consumption is backed by nuclear plants, and this makes France one of the cleanest country in terms of energy consumption in the world. I just don't understan…

It's not infinitely available, you could not run the whole world on it. You'd have to build a plant per day for (IIRC) 20 years, and since that's their lifespan, you'd just keep on decommissioning and building plants. And, if you were using them for all the world's energy, you'd quickly run out of Uranium. So, no.

Re: Germany to be nuclear-free by 2022

#36

Post by latch »

vladd wrote: post #3
sapper2 wrote: post #2

Good move aka burning bridges. If managed right, this will enhance the development and use of better technologies.

Nuclear is the safest form of energy that we currently have. More people die from installing solar panels than deaths occurred in nuclear accidents: http://nextbigfuture.com/2008/03/deaths-per-twh-for-all-ener... .

I've heard that argument before. I'm actually inclined to believe the general sentiment (in the sense that producing and burning most non-renewables, or building huge dams is disgusting). However, I'm highly skeptical that they are accurately tracking long term health effects of radiation poisoning.

Re: Germany to be nuclear-free by 2022

#37

Post by blumentopf »

Debunking myths:

"This won't have consequences, it didn't have any in Sweden either."

=> After the nuclear phase-out was enacted in 2000, two power plants were shut down as planned (Stade 2003, Obrigheim 2005).

=> After the Fukushima incident, eight additional plants were shut down and will never return to the grid again.

"This just leads to increasing energy imports."

=> Germany exported 9 billion kWh in 1Q2010, can hands-down afford shutting down nuclear power plants. Source: http://www.klimaretter.info/energie/hintergrund/6271-deutsch...

Re: Germany to be nuclear-free by 2022

#38

Post by rrrazdan »

latch wrote: post #19
Derbasti wrote: post #11

I guess it is pretty obvious that a non-nuclear energy strategy will definitely result in higher energy prices in the short term. That said, some people might be comfortable with this as long as the price increase is moderate. In the long run however, renewable energy sources are absolutely the way to go. It might actually pay off nicely to invest a lot of resources in renewable energy early on and come out ahead of…

I agree..except that's assuming a static world for the next decade. Both China and India are intently looking into Thorium reactors (and the US sorta is)...that's where I'd put my money too.

Yup. Thorium fuel cycle is the holy grail of Indian nuclear research. Its the main focus if not the only major focus. This could change but with our investments in renewable energy and closed thorium cycle, we could be looking at a more cleaner future for the world.

As for the risks associated with the nuclear power, its clearly a necessary risk. India consumes 1/25th of the American per capita consumption. Even assuming we consume less than US that's a lot of new electricity that has to be added to the grid. Something renewable energy can't provide. I would rather have us build reactors than coal plants. Of course all bets are off, if we ever tame fusion.

http://www.physorg.com/news205141972.html http://www.indiadaily.com/editorial/19093.asp

Re: Germany to be nuclear-free by 2022

#39

Post by sapper2 »

bluedanieru wrote: post #5
sapper2 wrote: post #2

Good move aka burning bridges. If managed right, this will enhance the development and use of better technologies.

You can apply this reasoning to anything, so what makes you think it necessarily applies to nuclear power? That is to say, by what reasoning do you argue that nuclear power itself isn't a 'better technology'? And better than what?

A technology that can - by the core physics behind it - make large parts of a country uninhabitable upon failure has no future. And is crazy for a small country like Japan.

Maybe it is better than coal. But Germany plans to replace them with renewable energy.

Re: Germany to be nuclear-free by 2022

#40

Post by lispm »

henrikschroder wrote: post #6

Sweden held a referendum in 1980 about nuclear power, and the only choice was about how fast our nuclear power plants should be shut down. It took twenty years until a reactor was closed, and five more years until one whole plant was closed. During this time, Sweden's energy consumption has of course gone up, and although there's been some increase in wind and water power, the net result is that each time we close a…

Germany has increased the use of renewable energy in a decade from 6 to 16% for the generation of electrical energy. The laws and regulation have been put in place: the EEG. This law has been copied world-wide by dozens of countries.

The goal is to be at 100% with renewable energy in 2050. The closing down of the nuclear power plants is only one milestone on that way. The fossil-based plants will be reduced over time, too. As a bridge technology gas power plants are seen which make it possible to use heat and electricity. Those have an extremely high degree of efficiency. The gas supply is there. New pipelines are being built currently.

Closing down the nuclear power plants is one goal. They are extremely expensive and they need huge amounts of money which we need to invest in renewable energy technology. Also the nuclear industry favors the big corporations who prevent market mechanisms and try to undermine any new energy source. They are also not flexible enough to be used in a future energy mix.

Given that the goal is to go fully to renewable energy in the next 40 years, the nuclear power plants have to go first. The acceptance for them in the German society is also at an all time low.

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