Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Drug decriminalization in Oregon begins today

drugpolicy.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 242 posts

Re: Drug decriminalization in Oregon begins today

#81

Post by andybak »

anewaccount2021 wrote: post #58

The not-homeless, not-drug-addict rest-of-society is already well on its way with its response...gated communities. No homeless, no open drug use...all protected by private property laws and private security. Get ready for more of them. It doesn't matter what laws you will pass, you don't get past the front gate unless your card scans. In the end, the only people who will be forced to look at open drug use and homele…

I'm not sure what you're saying here. For a start you're conflating drug use, open drug use and drug addiction. Homelessness obviously has some correlation with some types of drug use but there's a lot of non-homeless, non-addicted drug users. And you haven't touched on hard vs soft, addictive vs non-addictive drug use.

I'm not disagreeing because I'm genuinely not sure what point you're making?

Re: Drug decriminalization in Oregon begins today

#82

Post by recursive »

throwaway0a5e wrote: post #72
recursive wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Drinking a six-pack at a time does sound kind of binge-y to me.

Start with dinner at 6 and go to bed at 9 and that's 2/hr. Not exactly keg stands and jungle juice territory. The human body processes 1-2 drinks/hr so at the end you'll have a buzz on the order of one stiff mixed drink (~3-4 shots of stuff in the 40% ballpark spread out over a tall glass of sugary fruity stuff). Edit: And since apparently this needs saying "drink" = "the standard alcohol/drink unit that all the prof…

I have no doubt that much higher levels of consumption are possible.

I don't really have a position on what "binge" should mean, but that doesn't exactly sound like it's not. Could just be my perspective. I probably drink most days. Usually one beer. Rarely, I might have two in a day. I can't remember that last time I had more than that.

Re: Drug decriminalization in Oregon begins today

#83

Post by lotsofpulp »

throwaway0a5e wrote: post #72
recursive wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Drinking a six-pack at a time does sound kind of binge-y to me.

Start with dinner at 6 and go to bed at 9 and that's 2/hr. Not exactly keg stands and jungle juice territory. The human body processes 1-2 drinks/hr so at the end you'll have a buzz on the order of one stiff mixed drink (~3-4 shots of stuff in the 40% ballpark spread out over a tall glass of sugary fruity stuff). Edit: And since apparently this needs saying "drink" = "the standard alcohol/drink unit that all the prof…

“1-2 drinks/hr” is not a well defined metric. It’s better to use units of alcohol:

https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/alcohol-support/calculating-alc...

And more than 1 5% beer is outside of almost all people’s ability to “process” in an hour.

I would wager the majority of people based on size/weight can’t process a single 5% beer in an hour.

Re: Drug decriminalization in Oregon begins today

#84

Post by tastyfreeze »

worik wrote: post #54
tastyfreeze wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People are going to use drugs regardless of legality. There has been great harm to individuals from ingesting substances of questionable purity. Legalizing cannabis has allowed adults that choose to consume get consistent quality and avoid sketchy circumstances when purchasing. As for society as a whole it costs less to help people that abuse drugs than it does to imprison all drug users. We should not punish adults…

" it costs less to help people that abuse drugs " Even less if you leave the people who use drugs alone in their pleasures!

It would probably be helpful to define abuse of drugs as not being able to function in society as a result of use. The clinical definition of using more than the prescribed dose isn't very helpful. Depending on the drug a higher dose can be desirable for different reasons.

If somebody wants to check out of society I don't want to stop them. That is their choice. But if they are trying to participate in society and struggling with drug abuse we should try to help them.

Re: Drug decriminalization in Oregon begins today

#85

Post by cylon13 »

ogre_codes wrote: post #66
GuB-42 wrote: post #46

Just to make things clear, decriminalization is not legalization. Drugs are still illegal, and users risk a $100 fine, especially if they are uncooperative. The difference is that it is now a civil violation instead of a crime, so no record, no jail time, kind of like a parking ticket. Drug trafficking is still a crime.

> Drug trafficking is still a crime. Which is how this should be for many drugs. Though I would like a clean source for the occasional dose of LSD. Just... you know once a month or so.

Why should we force drug trafficking in to the underground, creating a black market and all the murder that comes with enforcing contracts within it, when people are just going to buy and consume drugs anyway? Because drugs are bad for you? The trade-off doesn't seem worth it.

Re: Drug decriminalization in Oregon begins today

#86

Post by rootusrootus »

ogre_codes wrote: post #74
throwaway0a5e wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In most states any amount over some small amount can be prosecuted as trafficking. I dunno what the limits are for Oregon. I'm pretty sure they get the same people who think a six pack is "binge drinking" and one range day's worth of ammo is a "stockpile" to come up with those limits.

In Oregon, drinking a six pack way well be binge drinking. High alcohol content beers are pretty common.

Indeed. Six of my favorite microbrews from Cascade Brewing and I would be very drunk. Heck, a single 750ml bottle of Sang Noir will last me a whole evening. Speaking of which, I have a bottle in the cupboard right now. Hmmmm.

Re: Drug decriminalization in Oregon begins today

#87

Post by lotsofpulp »

ogre_codes wrote: post #79
recursive wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Drinking a six-pack at a time does sound kind of binge-y to me.

Depends if it's piss-water or a quality stout or IPA.

A six pack of piss-water is still 12 units of alcohol, definitely far above what one should regularly consume if you want to minimize health risks:

https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/alcohol-support/calculating-alc...

My whole life I’ve been watching the “safe” amount of alcohol go down and down, study after study. The idea of casually drinking multiple beers after work every day is crazy to me.

Re: Drug decriminalization in Oregon begins today

#88

Post by Noos »

anewaccount2021 wrote: post #58

The not-homeless, not-drug-addict rest-of-society is already well on its way with its response...gated communities. No homeless, no open drug use...all protected by private property laws and private security. Get ready for more of them. It doesn't matter what laws you will pass, you don't get past the front gate unless your card scans. In the end, the only people who will be forced to look at open drug use and homele…

To be honest, can you blame them?

The petty crimes fueled by drug use don't go away if you decriminalize it. We keep throwing money at homelessness but it doesn't seem to work at all because a lot of the problem homeless really need to be involuntarily committed for long term treatment of mental illness or addiction. Not many people want to go down that route, because we still don't really trust or are comfortable with that.

People are going to compensate the only way they can. You aren't going to chide them for locking their doors when policies make it easier for people to rob others.

Re: Drug decriminalization in Oregon begins today

#89

Post by tastyfreeze »

lambda_obrien wrote: post #20
imperio59 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Experimenting with people's lives is not a responsible way to experiment. No one is denying these drugs are harmful, yet Oregon is basically saying "go ahead, it's fine, use these drugs". Seeing what is happening with the Marijuana lobbies coming in and putting in billions in lobbying should scare everybody. We have big tobacco to look at for where this leads. The next obvious step is to legalize all drugs, and let t…

> No one is denying these drugs are harmful Everything is harmful when used incorrectly, but useful when used correctly. I for one think these drugs are not inherently harmful, everything has a use. Why should doctors get to be a gatekeeper of my health if I choose to self medicate?

Not only are they not inherently harmful, humans have a many millennia long history of consuming substances to alter perception. I argue that drug use is part of who we are.

Re: Drug decriminalization in Oregon begins today

#90

Post by ndiscussion »

ericholscher wrote: post #52

Of interest, this is mostly a non-story in Oregon after it has passed. Our largest newspaper isn't even running a story on it: https://www.oregonlive.com/ Life continues as normal, just with fewer people in prison. As it should be.

The changes this policy drives will be apparent after several years, not several weeks.
Post reply on HN