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Visa May Add Cryptocurrencies to Its Payments Network, Says CEO

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Re: Visa May Add Cryptocurrencies to Its Payments Network, Says CEO

#111

Post by arcticbull »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #107
arcticbull wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree; the value provided by credit cards is the 0% APR 1-month unsecured loan that pays your transaction. This creates an ton of flexibility and by definition the rewards cost is returned to the buyer. 3% transaction fee means 0.1-0.2% to visanet, 2% in rewards and more than likely a large portion of the remainder is the cost of originating and serving that loan.

The rewards cost is returned to some, and is an expensive tax on others. If cheap float is desired, deposit account providers can provide it directly (some forward fintechs already do this).

It’s a small tax on some, sure, but also consider that the interchange rates merchants pay in the US vary by card brand and type. They actually charge much less for cards without reward programs (which are few and far between).

Re: Visa May Add Cryptocurrencies to Its Payments Network, Says CEO

#112

Post by lxe »

Have you used cryptocurrency for payments lately? Unless you want to pay $25 to wait 6 hours while your transaction is confirming, stick to venmo/zelle/paypal/etc...

Unless, of course, you use places like Coinbase that pool transactions or bypass the network altogether, but then... what's the point of cryptocurrency?

Re: Visa May Add Cryptocurrencies to Its Payments Network, Says CEO

#113

Post by briefcomment »

shanecoin wrote: post #9
bootyfarm wrote: post #6

Great, let’s all accelerate climate change even faster.

I hear this argument a lot and have a genuine question. How does Bitcoin electricity usage compare to something that achieves a similar goal? A good example is gold—many people compare Bitcoin to gold. What are the relative electricity costs of the two, and does that justify the cost of either asset? This would take into account the electricity costs of mining, labor, supply chain, storage, etc.

I think we should consider the possibility that Bitcoin greatly incentivizes saving and disincentivizes consumption, at least while prices are increasing as quickly as they are.

Re: Visa May Add Cryptocurrencies to Its Payments Network, Says CEO

#114

Post by whimsicalism »

lxe wrote: post #112

Have you used cryptocurrency for payments lately? Unless you want to pay $25 to wait 6 hours while your transaction is confirming, stick to venmo/zelle/paypal/etc... Unless, of course, you use places like Coinbase that pool transactions or bypass the network altogether, but then... what's the point of cryptocurrency?

Ethereum definitely doesn't cost that much and take that long as of late.

Re: Visa May Add Cryptocurrencies to Its Payments Network, Says CEO

#115

Post by haskaalo »

lxe wrote: post #112

Have you used cryptocurrency for payments lately? Unless you want to pay $25 to wait 6 hours while your transaction is confirming, stick to venmo/zelle/paypal/etc... Unless, of course, you use places like Coinbase that pool transactions or bypass the network altogether, but then... what's the point of cryptocurrency?

Have you looked into the bitcoin lightning network? Iirc, it has a much more bigger transaction per second rate than Visa network.

Re: Visa May Add Cryptocurrencies to Its Payments Network, Says CEO

#116

Post by londons_explore »

sneak wrote: post #76
londons_explore wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin allows transactions in the future. Thats effectively the same as a chargeback, since the sender of the money can decide at any point up to the time of the actual transfer to send the money elsewhere. You could theoretically design a hardware wallet (like a credit card) to only sign transactions three days into the future. That would give you three days to 'charge back' anything you don't like. Not sure mercha…

That's not really the same thing. A chargeback is mediated by a trusted third party, and the merchant knows that if they are reputable and do what they're supposed to, they'll get (usually) paid. Future (possibly reversible) payments don't really give the merchant the same risk cap that a credit card authorization does.

That can be done with bitcoin too. Just send the third party the money to forward on or send back after 3 days.

You can build more complex schemes where the third party can't just keep the money for themselves too.

Re: Visa May Add Cryptocurrencies to Its Payments Network, Says CEO

#117

Post by curation »

meowkit wrote: post #17
warent wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't the saying "Trust, but verify"

Yes and its a play on that phrase. You don't need to trust people on a blockchain, you have to trust the protocol, and then verify the results.

same

Re: Visa May Add Cryptocurrencies to Its Payments Network, Says CEO

#118

Post by eMGm4D0zgUAVXc7 »

flatline wrote: post #92

You don’t pay for things from your brokerage fund by cashing out your QQQ shares. You don’t pay for things with the gold in your home safe. You don’t keep funds in a foreign currency in your home country for everyday purchases. There is no use of bitcoin for which this seems well-suited.

> There is no use of bitcoin for which this seems well-suited.

All the things you listed are not identical to the new, very different asset class that is Bitcoin, so how can you deduce facts about Bitcoin from them?

E.g. they can't be transferred as easily as scanning a QR code with your smartphone, you can't store them in your brain, they can be de-valuated by governments, and so on.

Re: Visa May Add Cryptocurrencies to Its Payments Network, Says CEO

#119

Post by FDSGSG »

lxe wrote: post #112

Have you used cryptocurrency for payments lately? Unless you want to pay $25 to wait 6 hours while your transaction is confirming, stick to venmo/zelle/paypal/etc... Unless, of course, you use places like Coinbase that pool transactions or bypass the network altogether, but then... what's the point of cryptocurrency?

>Unless you want to pay $25 to wait 6 hours while your transaction is confirming, stick to venmo/zelle/paypal/etc

Those take much longer than 6 hours to "confirm", no? The sender can chargeback these transactions months after the money shows up in your account.

You don't even need to wait for confirmations unless the sum is huge. It's quite safe to accept most 0conf transactions.

Re: Visa May Add Cryptocurrencies to Its Payments Network, Says CEO

#120

Post by eMGm4D0zgUAVXc7 »

lxe wrote: post #112

Have you used cryptocurrency for payments lately? Unless you want to pay $25 to wait 6 hours while your transaction is confirming, stick to venmo/zelle/paypal/etc... Unless, of course, you use places like Coinbase that pool transactions or bypass the network altogether, but then... what's the point of cryptocurrency?

> Have you used cryptocurrency for payments lately? Unless you want to pay $25 to wait 6 hours while your transaction is confirming, stick to venmo/zelle/paypal/etc...

Nobody forces merchants to stick to requiring block confirmations for e.g. Bitcoin transactions.

They just do it because that's the way it always has been.

Instead of that, for low price purchases, they could also monitor the network for how well-spread a transaction is and once it is sufficiently propagated assume that a double-spend won't be possible anymore because miners will refuse to accept a transaction which conflicts with the one they saw much earlier.

And "well-spread" would be typically the case within seconds because transactions are flooded to all network nodes as they appear.

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