India protests: Internet cut to hunger-striking farmers in Delhi • Hacker News Board

Re: India protests: Internet cut to hunger-striking farmers in Delhi

#41

Post by middleclick » Sat, Jan 30, 2021, 10:09 PM UTC

throwawaysea wrote: post #38

middleclick wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I am all for peaceful protests, the constitution has given every citizen the right to protest They have been peaceful protesting for literally months now. One bad incident does not mean anything and there is a lot of information about how the government goons infiltrated the protests. If you are all for peaceful protests, you wouldn't single out one single incident but that's exactly what you are doing and I think…

Do you have strong, proven evidence for infiltration? Otherwise this seems like the typical false flag conspiracy we always hear when protests turn violent. The reality is even those acting peacefully are providing cover for those acting violently among their ranks. They also often incite that violent fringe to action, and condone or overlook their actions. Silence is violence, right? And remaining silent on those us…

Such things are typically reported by the media. One of the problems in India though is that the media is completely biased towards the government. The prime minister of the world's largest democracy has held exactly zero press conferences in 6-7 years. When he does, they are incredibly scripted where they ask him if he likes to eat mangoes (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dUyQWcn1CA). He also does a poor job of answering tough questions (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tAGAYL8dtic) so the media interviews he does give are more of a PR stunt for him where the "journalists" praise his qualities and ask him no hard questions.

Coming back to your question: the farmers have clearly said they denounce the violence in more than one ways. The other thing that is leading more credence to this theory is how the police treated the people indulging in violence. Evidence from the ground shows that the police shook hands and were generally very respectful towards them. This suggests infiltration. More sources: https://thewire.in/agriculture/day-of-clashes-with-bjp-spons...

Re: India protests: Internet cut to hunger-striking farmers in Delhi

#42

Post by 0xFFFE » Sat, Jan 30, 2021, 10:13 PM UTC

middleclick wrote: post #25

0xFFFE wrote: post #7

There is always two sides to the story, here is a "protester" attacking a cop with a sword. They are coordinating attacks using whatsapp and other means. https://www.republicworld.com/india-news/law-and-order/singh...

Pasting a Republic link is incredibly disingenuous because they frequently peddle fake news, not to mention, are extremely biased towards the current government, so much that their main person had access to sensitive intelligence information. Search: "arnab leaked chats"

>Search: "arnab leaked chats"

Similarly, searching for "Singhu border SHO attack" will give you many sources for the same incident.

Re: India protests: Internet cut to hunger-striking farmers in Delhi

#43

Post by middleclick » Sat, Jan 30, 2021, 10:13 PM UTC

0xFFFE wrote: post #40

middleclick wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you read your own links? > Samyukta Kisan Morcha, an umbrella organisation representing more than 40 farmers’ unions, condemned those who had taken part in the clashes and said that “anti-social elements had infiltrated the otherwise peaceful movement”. The organizers clearly condemned the violence. What else should they do? Repeating what you conveniently ignored: one bad incident does not override months of com…

> Repeating what you conveniently ignored: one bad incident does not override months of completely peaceful protests I am not the one conveniently forgetting violence at the Red fort. Let me ask you, why even protest when the Supreme court is hearing the case and Govt has agreed to put the law on hold for 1.5 years. Why violence & blocking highways? Why not take it up with Supreme Court?

The Supreme Court of India is going to listen to the farmers? The same Supreme Court that asked why and I quote, "why old people and women are kept in the protests" as if thousands of old farmers were paid money and brought in to the protests?

I repeat: protesting is a fundamental right. Farmers have been protesting peacefully for months. One bad incident is not reflective of the otherwise largely peaceful protests. You are ignoring this line.

https://www.newslaundry.com/2021/01/14/sorry-this-isnt-a-man...

You can drop the facade at this stage and stop wasting everyone's time. At least have the audacity to be genuine of your beliefs. To not be so is cowardly.

Re: India protests: Internet cut to hunger-striking farmers in Delhi

#44

Post by sandeeps_ » Sat, Jan 30, 2021, 10:14 PM UTC

postmeta wrote: post #23

Brozilean wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You think Elon Musk wouldn't cut starlink for folks if they were striking? Really?

Are you perhaps referring to the emerald-inheritance-richy-rich child-slave-loving-cobalt-mining 3rd-world-tweet-coup-leading union-busting-racist-workplace-of-terror-managing thai-pedo-twitter-bully covid-denier Elon that weird homeless hippy writers, wallstreetbros and proud-moms who didn't buy any $TSLA like to get their outrage chubs for?

Wow! You sure are salty about $TSLA!

Re: India protests: Internet cut to hunger-striking farmers in Delhi

#45

Post by alex_smart » Sat, Jan 30, 2021, 10:19 PM UTC

actuator wrote: post #14

bsan3 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope, complete propaganda by the Indian govt. I have family there so I can confirm. The Indian media is completely sold out to the govt and will only present highly selected and curated pictures. Social media is where they can't control the narrative. The Indian govt unleash sate sanctioned mobs on these protestors, desperate resort to break up the protest. Now they had to ensure that the truth stays under wraps. Hen…

I don't think we are talking about the same thing. I was talking about the protestors attacking cops of which there are a lot of videos on social media. The video I linked above shows them jumping from a fort to save themselves.

There is plenty of propaganda floating around from both sides. If you dislike muddy waters, I would recommend staying out of Indian politics. It is a clusterfuck.

To add to your top comment, these events - protestors attacking police personnel and protestors raiding Red Fort and raising their own flags - happened on republic day, which is like a mini 4th of July for India (we have two: 15th August, which is when India became independent and 26th January, which is when India adopted its constitution). On Republic Day, India observes the president furl India's national flag from the Red Fort, so seeing these events unfold, especially seeing a flag other than the Indian flag at Red Fort on Republic Day, were of very big symbolic value.

Re: India protests: Internet cut to hunger-striking farmers in Delhi

#46

Post by codesternews » Sat, Jan 30, 2021, 10:20 PM UTC

Sadly the Indian govt passed the laws without taking opposition and farmers in confidence. They passed the law very bluntly. Thats from where all this started.

It's very simple thing to solve but current govt want to make it political. They are basically saying MSP(Minimum selling price) is not affected. But farmers protesting why you include this in bill.

But because of govt ego millions of farmers are protesting for their own livelihood.

Re: India protests: Internet cut to hunger-striking farmers in Delhi

#47

Post by midasuni » Sat, Jan 30, 2021, 10:22 PM UTC

0xFFFE wrote: post #42

middleclick wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pasting a Republic link is incredibly disingenuous because they frequently peddle fake news, not to mention, are extremely biased towards the current government, so much that their main person had access to sensitive intelligence information. Search: "arnab leaked chats"

>Search: "arnab leaked chats" Similarly, searching for "Singhu border SHO attack" will give you many sources for the same incident.

Choosing such a bad source by default pretty much wipes your credibility out.

It like saying domestic drinking is up and posting

https://waterfordwhispersnews.com/2021/01/29/local-man-to-sp...

As proof. You may have had a point, but it’s lost from your source.

Re: India protests: Internet cut to hunger-striking farmers in Delhi

#48

Post by bsan3 » Sat, Jan 30, 2021, 10:22 PM UTC

systemvoltage wrote: post #29

Is it fair to say that the pandemic has brewed more protests than ever, not just in India but worldwide? It's not to diminish the issues, but the pandemic is adding fuel? Most countries around the world are facing protests all simultaneously after the pandemic (except China)?

The pandemic seems to be exposing the wealth inequality, which I think is the root issue here. The haves have even more and the nots bore the brunt. Judging by protests, approaching breaking point

Re: India protests: Internet cut to hunger-striking farmers in Delhi

#49

Post by AmericanChopper » Sat, Jan 30, 2021, 10:28 PM UTC

0xFFFE wrote: post #15

didibus wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm honestly not seeing two sides sorry. So a few people are breaking laws, you disconnect the internet? That's not two sides, that's only one side. If someone in my neighborhood is a criminal, they don't cut the power to my neighborhood and throw flair bombs at it. How is that the "other side"? Instead they just go after that criminal. To me it looks like a massive imbalance in power from one side over the other.

I am all for peaceful protests, the constitution has given every citizen the right to protest. But not at the cost of damage to the public property, rioting and violence. Jfyi, there is already case in supreme court of India to hear the grievances that they may have. But some political leaders are taking advantage of the situation to incite violence. Please note, cops are human beings too, they have been asked not to…

How do you feel about the revolutionary war? Or the Jacobite uprisings? Or the troubles? Or the French Resistance? Or the Yugoslav Partisans?

I’m all for peaceful solutions too, but if you look through history you’ll find plenty of morally righteous violent resistance. In this case it seems inevitable to me. The aggrieved parties here mostly come from a place that was previously violently conquered by the Mughal Empire, then later violently won their independence to form the Sikh Empire, shortly after that they were violently conquered again by the British Raj. The British Raj was ousted by nonviolent resistance, but that’s an incredible anomaly in history, and was only really possible because the British had largely lost interest in holding the colony.

The result was the partitioning of India, which worked out terribly for a lot of people. Especially the Punjabis, who’s state was cut in half and split between Islamic Pakistan, and Hindu India. Hindu Nationalism on the India side of the border has lead to decades of often violent oppression of minority group in India. Why would violent resistance not be a morally defensible response?

I also find the international coverage of this issue quite funny. If you only read international sources you might come away with the impression that this conflict is just between “farmers” and the Indian government. If you read Indian sources you’re more likely to get the impression this is a separatist conflict between “Khalistani terrorists” and the Indian government.

Re: India protests: Internet cut to hunger-striking farmers in Delhi

#50

Post by 0xFFFE » Sat, Jan 30, 2021, 10:39 PM UTC

AmericanChopper wrote: post #49

0xFFFE wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am all for peaceful protests, the constitution has given every citizen the right to protest. But not at the cost of damage to the public property, rioting and violence. Jfyi, there is already case in supreme court of India to hear the grievances that they may have. But some political leaders are taking advantage of the situation to incite violence. Please note, cops are human beings too, they have been asked not to…

How do you feel about the revolutionary war? Or the Jacobite uprisings? Or the troubles? Or the French Resistance? Or the Yugoslav Partisans? I’m all for peaceful solutions too, but if you look through history you’ll find plenty of morally righteous violent resistance. In this case it seems inevitable to me. The aggrieved parties here mostly come from a place that was previously violently conquered by the Mughal Empi…

So if this not a protest against the farm bill, they should drop the facade then.

> you’ll find plenty of morally righteous violent resistance.

Sure, but we should have a sense of proportion here. Supreme court is hearing the case and the Govt has agreed to put the new law on hold for 1.5 years. Why not wait for Supreme court's judgement?

How do you justify blocking highways for over 2 months causing great economic damage to your fellow countrymen, that too during COVID times when people are struggling to put the food on the table.

I have read the bill and I am linking it here (this is Govt. Of India website). There is nothing there that can justify the violence we just witnessed.

http://egazette.nic.in/WriteReadData/2020/222040.pdf