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Coinbase announces proposed direct listing

blog.coinbase.com

121–130 of 222 posts

Re: Coinbase announces proposed direct listing

#121

The AirBNB listing showed that banks favor their friends and clients in an IPO, when the price surged well before the debut allowed us Little People to buy. A direct listing would be cool and I hope they pursue that.

Alternatively - Airbnb selected investors that they knew would hold the stock and support their long-term vision for the product/brand.

Those investors being inclined to hold, did not sell, yielding a relatively small float that was massively outstripped by demand, causing the price to skyrocket.

Maybe some of those investors were friends of the bankers and cashed out but that would only be (a small) part of the story

Re: Coinbase announces proposed direct listing

#122

Shows how much they trust what they're selling I guess. If BTC and ETH are just a replacement for visa and mastercard, they've done a good job, in that they've driven visa and mastercard to be so fast and cheap that it's essentially impossible for any blockchain based solution to be faster or cheaper per transaction. Heck, my visa card pays me 0.3% nowadays. So what's the purpose of crypto if it's centralized by a co…

> Heck, my visa card pays me 0.3% nowadays.

Does your visa pay the merchants too? If banks/cards are are still charging merchants 2-3%, then some of that is passed on to us users as well (just not explicitly)

Re: Coinbase announces proposed direct listing

#123

LOL Isn't the whole point of cryptocurrency to produce an alternative to the current financial system? Coinbase entering the traditional stock-market is a flat-out rejection of that; They're just another bank, except they trade in ponzi schemes rather than government-backed currency. Awful

Yup but coinbase and binance regularly stop trading to stop pumps in the crypto market. The thing is in crypto there’s DEXs and DEFI. Coinbase and binance are doomed long term. If you haven’t look into uniswap and 1inch.

Coinbase is the future of finance.

Monero (and other privacy coins) are the future of DeFi.

Re: Coinbase announces proposed direct listing

#124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am aware-ish of that and (edit, forgot the "and") Graeber's book but haven't read either. The Geiger counter randomized debt jubilee is a bit of a play on the scheduling problem. I do agree debt jubilees only make sense as a emergency post-hoc fix. If you think about it, UBI + good confiscatory taxes at the margins is basically a nice smoothed amortized debt jubilee. That's much better.

Ha, Graeber's debt book is a different one [0]. I can vouch for its excellence, but I don't recall him discussing jubilees much. A cursory search isn't turning up much, do you have any reading material for the Geiger counter idea? Or is that something you're spit-balling just now? :) Agreed on UBI, etc. One thing I've been thinking a lot about is the Ultimatum Game [1], and what it would look like to scale up that co…

> is a different one

Yes, I forgot the "and". "that Graeber" lol. Pity there is no more "that graeber" :(. To think Chomsky outlived him...crazy...

> Or is that something you're spit-balling just now? :)

Pure spitball. If predictibility causes bias, try randomness. PRNG is fine except one could exfiltrate the hidden state maybe? So try something even more black-box like a hunk of radioactive something.

> Agreed on UBI

:)

> One thing I've been thinking a lot about is the Ultimatum Game [1], and what it would look like to scale up that concept to a society. In a sense, that's the realpolitik of every state: if the peasants are sufficiently unhappy, they show up with torches and pitchforks, even at the cost of their short-term interests. The modern peaceful version is "vote the bums out", but that's always been of dubious efficacy; and it feels especially toothless today, given the scope of regulatory capture and "manufactured consent" in the two-party system. The next closest thing (without resorting to violence) probably looks like a General Strike, but that's one hell of a coordination problem.

There is the quote "I have found out what economics is; it is the science of confusing stocks with flows". I had some crude thoughts in my own head, but with some friend's advise on putting in that terminology, it seems both that the stocks are are more fictions and the source of the economic problems of society. I question the ultimate game example then because it seems very "stocks first", dividing up some amount one off. I would much rather see "capitalism without ownership" or "rents all the way down".

Re: Coinbase announces proposed direct listing

#125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup but coinbase and binance regularly stop trading to stop pumps in the crypto market. The thing is in crypto there’s DEXs and DEFI. Coinbase and binance are doomed long term. If you haven’t look into uniswap and 1inch.

Can you use uniswap or 1inch as a fiat onramp?

I do not believe there are currently any dencentralized onramps for exchanging fiat for any crypto directly. Though I would wager this is an issue with banks not supporting smart contracts in a way that would allow automated withdrawals and deposits from/to the crypto networks.

Re: Coinbase announces proposed direct listing

#126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think generally you can place an order before the market opens, maybe even the day before, but that doesn't really give you any pricing power. It will still pop at the open and your order may not clear until it does. But that may still put you ahead of the Robinhood masses. Better option might be to try a pre-IPO trading platform like EquityZen.

From EquitZen's knowledge center: "Shares that are the subject of investment through EquityZen are generally subject to a lock-up period of up to 180 days after the effectiveness of a company's IPO filing, during which time shareholders are restricted from selling their shares."[1] The 180day lock-up period could EquityZen poorly suited for investors with a short time horizon.

In this case though, Coinbase is doing a direct listing, not an IPO. I think there is usually no lockup associated with a direct listing.

Re: Coinbase announces proposed direct listing

#127

Shows how much they trust what they're selling I guess. If BTC and ETH are just a replacement for visa and mastercard, they've done a good job, in that they've driven visa and mastercard to be so fast and cheap that it's essentially impossible for any blockchain based solution to be faster or cheaper per transaction. Heck, my visa card pays me 0.3% nowadays. So what's the purpose of crypto if it's centralized by a co…

> Heck, my visa card pays me 0.3% nowadays. Does your visa pay the merchants too? If banks/cards are are still charging merchants 2-3%, then some of that is passed on to us users as well (just not explicitly)

That is true, and you are right on this front.

That being said, I do have a business accepting card payments and the 2-3% for me is closer to 0.1% past bank fees.

But you're right that from the merchant's perspective, depending on country (e.g. the US) things can be worst.

Then again, from the merchant's perspective cryptos seem to have much larger downsides, after all there's a reason why they aren't widely used, and lack of good supplied for crypto is larger than lack of people willing to use them.

Re: Coinbase announces proposed direct listing

#128

LOL Isn't the whole point of cryptocurrency to produce an alternative to the current financial system? Coinbase entering the traditional stock-market is a flat-out rejection of that; They're just another bank, except they trade in ponzi schemes rather than government-backed currency. Awful

The big difference is that you are able to deliver Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies to your own wallet, after which Coinbase loses control of it.

Who controls your money after you withdraw it from a traditional bank?

Re: Coinbase announces proposed direct listing

#129
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not with a direct listing. Coinbase shares would be subject to an auction and the market for them will open at the price where supply meets demand.

Not entirely true - since people had to enter a single point on their demand curve as a price and quantity of shares (instead of their entire demand curve) the market clearing price was artificially low. Hence the price pop on day one. To think about it more in depth - assume I enter a bid of 100 shares at $100. If the market clearing price is $50, I’ll be awarded 100 shares at $50. However, I was willing to buy far…

[deleted]

Re: Coinbase announces proposed direct listing

#130

LOL Isn't the whole point of cryptocurrency to produce an alternative to the current financial system? Coinbase entering the traditional stock-market is a flat-out rejection of that; They're just another bank, except they trade in ponzi schemes rather than government-backed currency. Awful

> LOL Isn't the whole point of cryptocurrency to produce an alternative to the current financial system?

Coinbase is basically a bridge between traditional and decentralized finance.

> Coinbase entering the traditional stock-market is a flat-out rejection of that; They're just another bank, except they trade in ponzi schemes rather than government-backed currency. Awful

My guess is they debated internally whether to do an IEO but ultimately decided it was not worth the regulatory risk.

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