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IKEA buys 11,000 acres of U.S. forest to keep it from being developed

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Re: IKEA buys 11,000 acres of U.S. forest to keep it from being developed

#231

Post by andy_ppp »

pelasaco wrote: post #34
andy_ppp wrote: post #5

How much would buying all the Brazilian rain forest cost the world, or even renting it from Brazil? We would need it to be slightly more than cattle farming to work... but I’d happily pay towards this.

well, in first place Brazil (or Peru, Suriname, etc) should be wanting to sell or rent it. Which they aren't. Second, it won't help to buy or rent it if there is no control in the region. Third, Europe together with China are the biggest market of illegal wood. France has a high military presence on the French Guyana, and they could definitely pass intelligence to some navy to catch the boats leaving Brazil/Suriname…

Everyone has a price... it’d just be interesting to calculate the total cost of purchasing and enforcement. Probably into the tens of billions per year? More? Once there is a figure people might think it’s worth doing or not.

Re: IKEA buys 11,000 acres of U.S. forest to keep it from being developed

#232

Post by smileybarry »

gregoriol wrote: post #193
piokoch wrote: post #14

This smells like some really bold and really ridiculous PR attempt. "Ikea uses about one percent—yes, one percent—of the world's entire commercial wood supply. That amounts to about 17.8 million cubic yards of lumber last year. " [1] I guess they need this PR purchase to appease some eko organization. And this is equally ridiculous. Ikea is making furniture, something people really need. Why they have to explain them…

IKEA uses wood? really? I thought they used shitty agglomerates and other mixes in their furniture, maybe all the wood is for something else?

They have some full wood products, some of their pricier desks, dining tables and kitchen countertops are full wood. Maybe all those thin wood covers on everything else add up, too.

Re: IKEA buys 11,000 acres of U.S. forest to keep it from being developed

#233

Post by perilunar »

trymas wrote: post #68
fy20 wrote: post #7

Somewhat related. IKEA is the largest owner of forests in Lithuania (around 33% of the total land area is forest): https://www.lrt.lt/en/news-in-english/19/1104260/ikea-the-bi... At the time of this article (2019), they owned 66,000 acres of forest in the country.

For someone who does not know how much is an acre: 66k acres is ~27k hectares or 270sq.km.

> 66k acres is ~27k hectares

That's a strange way to put it.

More obviously, 1 acre ~= 0.4 hectares or ~4000 m²

Alternatively, 1 hectare ~= 2.5 acres

Re: IKEA buys 11,000 acres of U.S. forest to keep it from being developed

#234

Post by TeMPOraL »

mystcb wrote: post #222
loceng wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's because they're fighting the arguably true reality that the majority of their furniture is designed to be disposable, and consumers are generally fine with that. I'd like to be wrong, though until we require companies to be responsible for all costs associated with the full lifecycle of a product so externalized costs are incorporated, we're not going to develop the most sustainable practices.

From a different point of view, I would say that I don't see their furniture as "designed to be disposable", more that there is good marked for re-use through other people. Spotted a few comments from people saying they have had second hand items (3rd, 4th etc) - and I think that in my head is where my version of "disposable" has come from. When I no longer want an Ikea product because it doesn't fit, or no longer ne…

When people say "designed to be disposable" they don't mean reuse is not possible - just not likely, because a thing wears out quickly, or is a hassle to give someone else. Former means there's not much of a second-hand market, the latter means that even giving away for free is too much work compared to just dumping it.

I'm very much surprised about the amount of comments here on HN (today and in many previous discussions) that claim to reuse IKEA furniture; it's completely contrary to my experience. My opinion of IKEA furniture is that it's single-assembly - trying to break it apart irreparably destroys it.

I conclude there must be either high variance in IKEA's production quality, or we're comparing apples to oranges. Maybe some IKEA products have more reassembly potential than others. Someone mentioned an office chair elsewhere in the thread - yeah, that obviously can last years and be moved, because it's made of metal and hard plastics. But most IKEA furniture I experienced is made of dried toilet paper glued with formaldehyde^W^W^W^W^W^Wmedium-density fibreboard and assembles destructively.

Re: IKEA buys 11,000 acres of U.S. forest to keep it from being developed

#235

Post by retSava »

koheripbal wrote: post #213
kuschku wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can just go to any IKEA and buy a replacement part? Every single part they've ever sold is available at the replacement desk in their stores (at least here in Germany). Even individual screws, legs, etc. When I broke a door and one of the hinges of a kitchen cabinet, I just went to IKEA and bought a replacement door (of the exact same type) and replacement hinge) and replaced them.

Repairing a couch is not an option unless you're skilled in re-apolstering.

Well that goes for all couches, ikea or not, doesn't it? That wasn't the question here.

Re: IKEA buys 11,000 acres of U.S. forest to keep it from being developed

#236

Post by glenneroo »

jcims wrote: post #206
DoingIsLearning wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Buying rain forest would mean nothing for illegal rare wood markets, or illegal gold mining, or illegal forest fires to stretch cattle grazing area. Most people grossly underestimate how wild and pretty much lawless inland rain-forest regions are in the Brazilian state of Amazonas . There are small pockets of settlements everywhere but except for Manaus there is very sparse infrastructure, Police will take days to ge…

Pretty sure most would support repurposing Tomahawk missiles and MQ-9 Reapers for the protection of the Amazon.

I'm not sure that firing missiles into forests is the most intelligent use of resources...

Re: IKEA buys 11,000 acres of U.S. forest to keep it from being developed

#237

Post by dagw »

2muchcoffeeman wrote: post #223
dagw wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it goes back to the thrift store Last time I moved I found that thrift stores are very picky about what furniture they accept.

Take care of your furniture or give it away to those in need?

give it away to those in need?

Tried that as well. They took a dining table with a few scratches in it, but no charity I talked to wanted bookshelves or TV stands/media benches.

Re: IKEA buys 11,000 acres of U.S. forest to keep it from being developed

#238

Post by detritus »

TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #216
usrusr wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but to get a long term net effect we'd have to bury them about as deep as the fossils we are excavating. I dare claim that this won't happen (it would be far cheaper/more efficient to leave those fossils and synthesize something from those trees up here) Sometimes I wonder, as a mind experiment, how close we could get to practical carbon burial with a process based on sinking polymer blocks in the ocean: the spe…

> to get a long term net effect we'd have to bury them about as deep as the fossils we are excavating. Why? What is wrong with capturing carbon the way trees naturally do? (Honest question)

I think they mean 'after the tree has been cut down or otherwise reached the end of its life'.

Re: IKEA buys 11,000 acres of U.S. forest to keep it from being developed

#239

Post by smileybarry »

isthisnametaken wrote: post #191

"IKEA is continuing to try and remain true to their principals—protecting the environment and striving to become a carbon neutral company, while still remaining one of the world’s most pleasurable shopping experiences." Written by someone who has clearly never been to an IKEA.

I like it! The huge selection and tens of showrooms are really cool. I especially like their "whole apartment" demos, like maximizing use out of a small apartment without making it cramped.

It's definitely not for everyone, my sister hates the "gauntlet" (as someone else here called it) and how busy it gets.

Re: IKEA buys 11,000 acres of U.S. forest to keep it from being developed

#240

Post by detritus »

glenneroo wrote: post #236
jcims wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty sure most would support repurposing Tomahawk missiles and MQ-9 Reapers for the protection of the Amazon.

I'm not sure that firing missiles into forests is the most intelligent use of resources...

Why not? You'd likely not need IraqWarII levels of commitment - just a few enthusiastically-delivered missives at 1100kph to get the message across. A few loitering drones and a few dozen more missiles might actually be a highly efficient use of resources. I'm not sure where 'intelligence' comes into play here, beyond condescension of an idea you evidently disagree with.
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