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Grindr to be fined almost €10M over GDPR complaint

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Re: Grindr to be fined almost €10M over GDPR complaint

#131

Post by privacylawthrow »

dthul wrote: post #123
Vinnl wrote: post #16

> Grindr is now relying on a new consent system and alleged "legitimate interest" to use data without user consent. This is in conflict with the decision of the Norwegian DPA, as it explicitly held that "any extensive disclosure ... for marketing purposes should be based on the data subject’s consent". This "legitimate interest" shenanigans is coming up more and more often, where you have a modal with lots of options…

On some websites I get a tracking / cookie consent popup which, if I choose not to consent to everything, leaves me hanging for a _very_ long time while "saving my settings". I am talking about 30-60 seconds here. That must be deliberate to keep you from denying consent. I forgot which company it was but I immediately recognize those popups.

Some tools call APIs from a whole bunch of ad networks. That 60 seconds is likely spent getting opt out cookies from dozens of different ad network domains.

Re: Grindr to be fined almost €10M over GDPR complaint

#132

Post by aenario »

xtracto wrote: post #125

The GDPR has always amazed me. It changed the playing field from "you can use our free app as long as you give us data for marketing or not use it" to "you can provide a free service in the EU as long as you dont collect data for marketing or dont provide it" Without making a judgement on the merits of the approach, as a user/individual I appreciate the power this gives to protect my data. As a company/developer the…

As a company/developer starting from scratch, there is really no complexity nor landmines : Do as you say, Say what you do, Give the user options.

You can offer the user the choice between targeted advertising or non-targeted. You can offer the user the choice between paid subscription or advertising.

Cant get enough users to pay or consent ? Then you did not find market-fit in the real world.

Re: Grindr to be fined almost €10M over GDPR complaint

#133

Post by dthul »

sseneca wrote: post #128
dthul wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On some websites I get a tracking / cookie consent popup which, if I choose not to consent to everything, leaves me hanging for a _very_ long time while "saving my settings". I am talking about 30-60 seconds here. That must be deliberate to keep you from denying consent. I forgot which company it was but I immediately recognize those popups.

Is it TrustArc? I remember having a similar experience with their pop-up, for example on Oracle's website when I'm looking for Java docs: https://docs.oracle.com/en/java/ That example doesn't have the long loading times for me any more, but I'm almost certain it was the TrustArc pop-up.

Yes, I believe it was TrustArc.

Re: Grindr to be fined almost €10M over GDPR complaint

#134

Post by xxs »

gspr wrote: post #90
yarcob wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are also passport checks when you fly to Norway from other EU countries. For flights between other EU countries you generally just show the QR code on your phone. At least that was my experience, but it's been a few years since I last flew. (Except flights to UK before Brexit, I think they always required passport checks)

> There are also passport checks when you fly to Norway from other EU countries. This is incorrect. And the presence or absence of these checks is not a EU/EEA matter. The passport free movement is a matter of the Schengen agreement. This is why the UK had passport checks with most of continental Europe back when they were EU members (but not Schengen members). Norway is a Schengen member, and an EEA member, but not…

>note that it hasn't been updated for Brex

Ah, even Croatia is outside the EU on the diagram - so it's way worse than that. That being said: Croatia is outside Schengen as well.

Re: Grindr to be fined almost €10M over GDPR complaint

#135

Post by ratww »

privacylawthrow wrote: post #131
dthul wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On some websites I get a tracking / cookie consent popup which, if I choose not to consent to everything, leaves me hanging for a _very_ long time while "saving my settings". I am talking about 30-60 seconds here. That must be deliberate to keep you from denying consent. I forgot which company it was but I immediately recognize those popups.

Some tools call APIs from a whole bunch of ad networks. That 60 seconds is likely spent getting opt out cookies from dozens of different ad network domains.

TrustArc's doesn't, or at least didn't the last two times I inspected it deeply. It is possible to reproduce this claim by checking the browser inspector Network tab and by debugging trough the source code: it's just a bunch of setTimeouts.

Not to mention that if there were any hypothetical API calls those could be made asynchronously after closing the modal.

It's purely a dark pattern.

Re: Grindr to be fined almost €10M over GDPR complaint

#136

Post by Nextgrid »

privacylawthrow wrote: post #131
dthul wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On some websites I get a tracking / cookie consent popup which, if I choose not to consent to everything, leaves me hanging for a _very_ long time while "saving my settings". I am talking about 30-60 seconds here. That must be deliberate to keep you from denying consent. I forgot which company it was but I immediately recognize those popups.

Some tools call APIs from a whole bunch of ad networks. That 60 seconds is likely spent getting opt out cookies from dozens of different ad network domains.

I thought so as well but if I recall correctly someone explicitly disproved that. Should be fairly easy to confirm by checking the traffic in the network tab - unless the ad networks themselves take 60 seconds to respond there should be no reason for that much delay.

Re: Grindr to be fined almost €10M over GDPR complaint

#137

Post by Anther »

dthul wrote: post #123
Vinnl wrote: post #16

> Grindr is now relying on a new consent system and alleged "legitimate interest" to use data without user consent. This is in conflict with the decision of the Norwegian DPA, as it explicitly held that "any extensive disclosure ... for marketing purposes should be based on the data subject’s consent". This "legitimate interest" shenanigans is coming up more and more often, where you have a modal with lots of options…

On some websites I get a tracking / cookie consent popup which, if I choose not to consent to everything, leaves me hanging for a _very_ long time while "saving my settings". I am talking about 30-60 seconds here. That must be deliberate to keep you from denying consent. I forgot which company it was but I immediately recognize those popups.

Ziff Davis sites do this. Very aggravating.

Re: Grindr to be fined almost €10M over GDPR complaint

#138

Post by nxpnsv »

ganzuul wrote: post #116
nxpnsv wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Compare to the median of straight men+women, or the median of straight men? In median, even in Norway women earn on average 80% of men. Assuming sexual orientation otherwise doesn't matter, there should then be a difference between gay men and straight people in general...

You are assuming the single foundation of your argument. Please don't do that.

I made likely what the post I answered to found unlikely. I could not find reliable stats for gay wages in Norway. Gender paygap is however very well monitored by http://www.ssb.no/ Arguably my point is not great. If you really want to know about gay conditions in Norway, try this report https://www.ssb.no/a/english/publikasjoner/pdf/rapp_201038_e...

Re: Grindr to be fined almost €10M over GDPR complaint

#139

Post by aenario »

Hitton wrote: post #113
virgilp wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, to make it more obvious - if users had the choice of paying with money or paying with their future voting rights, would that be "forcing users into signing their rights away?". Surely, not "forcing" since it's their choice - but, I hope we agree that it's a choice that should NOT be presented to them, at all. You may or may not agree on whether the right to privacy should be on the same level as the right to vo…

I don't share your paternalistic view of having to police people's actions. Giving informed consent to use some data (and eventually ability to withdraw that consent when the business between the parties ends) should be enough. And your comparison between sharing users' personal data, something that influences only them and voting rights (which are not transferable btw) that influence everyone is absolutely ludicrous…

I'd like to sell you some cough medication, it's all natural, made from a concentrate of two south-american plant called "coca" and "tabaco", everyone who tries keep asking for more, even when we increased the price !

Too bad the big bad governement regulation prevent me from selling it. It's absolutely ridiculous, all my customers wants it and I pay my taxes.

Re: Grindr to be fined almost €10M over GDPR complaint

#140

Post by nitrobeast »

fifilura wrote: post #89
zxcvbn4038 wrote: post #72

They are sending all of their user's data with an "opt out" flag and leaving it to the ad companies to honor it? Slow clap? It also caught my eye that their TOS didn't allow users a choice in data sharing, it was either agree or don't use the app. That might have some wide ramifications, I've encountered many web sites that won't let you past the sharing opt-in until you click agree - i.e. it is impossible to disagre…

There is a Norwegian connection there though. Grindr and Opera (browser) is owned by the same Chinese entrepreneur. Opera is still headquartered in Norway. Don't know if that helps, but there may be interesting corporate associations there.

Grindr’s Chinese owner has sold it to a US owner, forced by CFIUS (https://www.theverge.com/platform/amp/2020/3/6/21168079/grin...).
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