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Launch HN: Aviron (YC W21) – High-Intensity Peloton for Rowing

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Re: Launch HN: Aviron (YC W21) – High-Intensity Peloton for Rowing

#41

Post by FullNameAndy »

roemance wrote: post #18

How is this software different than Ergatta ( https://ergatta.com/ )? Do you offer the ability to connect the tablet to another device like a Concept2 rower?

Ergatta is a great alternative but different. From a hardware standpoint they don't have variable resistance. Our electronically controlled resistance adds up to 100+ lbs of force. Our high-intensity content, which differentiates us, requires this and the reason why we opted to build our own rower. When it comes to content, Ergatta has gamified workouts, whereas we have actual video games like Brick Breaker, races against Olympic athletes, guided strength programs that automatically adjust the resistance and let you use the rower for more than just rowing; like bicep curls and dips.

Re: Launch HN: Aviron (YC W21) – High-Intensity Peloton for Rowing

#42

Post by FullNameAndy »

snarkypixel wrote: post #9

I already have a rowing machine, I wish I could simply add the Aviron screen to it.

I get it. This it the most common question we are asked. A huge part of our experience is the electronically controlled resistance that adds up to 100+ lbs of force. Our high-intensity games and strength content, which differentiates us, requires this and the reason why we opted to build our own rower.

Re: Launch HN: Aviron (YC W21) – High-Intensity Peloton for Rowing

#44

Post by chermanowicz »

AWildC182 wrote: post #28
ADominic wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

also a former rower - I don't think we're the target market. If you've never touched an erg, it might not really matter whether you start on a C2 or not. And I'd guess controlling the hardware also gives them more control over the entire user experience + their own costs.

I see this as an insanely dangerous game. IME most non-rowers won't touch an erg without significant instruction/encouragement as they're technique dependent. Any that do will quickly figure out from anyone who has rowed that C2 is the standard and everything else on the market is flaming garbage. Add to this that I could recreate this business using the C2 API in a couple weeks and suddenly have a market of everyone…

This. As a former rower I'm biased, but also I have a C2 that sits around unused, mainly because as I've gotten older, I care less about the competitive/fitness optimization aspect of working out and more about fun.

Having tried several of the third party apps for C2, they've all suffered from 2 problems: pretty sub-par development/bugginess & wrong (or bad) content for the mass market. So much training oriented content and little on the fun/gamification side. I would pay $ for the right app, but not for a new rower. Ergatta is cool but again I wouldn't go out and buy one. When you think about the hundreds of thousands of C2s, it is a nice opportunity.

Re: Launch HN: Aviron (YC W21) – High-Intensity Peloton for Rowing

#45

Post by FullNameAndy »

candiddevmike wrote: post #14
FullNameAndy wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A huge part of our experience is the electronically controlled resistance that adds up to 100+ lbs of resistance. Our high-intensity games and strength content, which differentiates us, requires this and the reason why we opted to build our own rower.

Also concept2 owner. I think it's a miss not having some offering for existing rowers--these are not cheap devices, most people love their current one, and concept2's build quality has created a huge moat for them. Better to compete on software/integration instead of hardware as it makes your offering a niche player in an already niche market.

Good point. I think creating a solution that ties into existing rowers like the C2 isn't out of the question in the future.

Re: Launch HN: Aviron (YC W21) – High-Intensity Peloton for Rowing

#46

Post by Alex3917 »

AWildC182 wrote: post #35
FullNameAndy wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You make a good point re: the C2 market. I mentioned up top that a huge part of our experience is the electronically controlled resistance that adds up to 100+ lbs of force. Our high-intensity games and strength content, which differentiates us, requires this and the reason why we opted to build our own rower. Thanks for the feedback.

Edited my comment when I saw this. This is exceedingly dangerous. Ask any rower that's worked with people on C2 machines. Everyone will instinctively throw the damper to setting 10, then throw their back due to bad posture.

> Everyone will instinctively throw the damper to setting 10, then throw their back due to bad posture.

The people who do that normally only row for a few minutes at a time, and aren't really at any significant risk of injury. The only class of people who seem to consistently develop back problems from rowing machines are people who train on them for hours a day in high school and never lift weights.

All the other back injuries in rowing are usually from either sweep rowing or from lifting.

Re: Launch HN: Aviron (YC W21) – High-Intensity Peloton for Rowing

#47

Post by FullNameAndy »

dumbfoundded wrote: post #12

I always felt a large missing aspect was the realism as it relates to water. In particular, on a machine you neither feather nor feel variable resistance due to how vertical your blade is. There are a lot of specific details that the machine doesn't capture that I think make the actual experience on the water much more thoughtful than just pulling as hard and fast as you can.

You are 100% right. We try our best to create an experience that is as similar to rowing on water as possible, but of course it won't be the same. But most people who purchase our rower aren't looking for a realistic experience, they want an amazing workout that's fun more than anything.

Re: Launch HN: Aviron (YC W21) – High-Intensity Peloton for Rowing

#48

Post by FullNameAndy »

AWildC182 wrote: post #35
FullNameAndy wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You make a good point re: the C2 market. I mentioned up top that a huge part of our experience is the electronically controlled resistance that adds up to 100+ lbs of force. Our high-intensity games and strength content, which differentiates us, requires this and the reason why we opted to build our own rower. Thanks for the feedback.

Edited my comment when I saw this. This is exceedingly dangerous. Ask any rower that's worked with people on C2 machines. Everyone will instinctively throw the damper to setting 10, then throw their back due to bad posture.

Good point. We do our best to educate users with intro rowing videos that can be found on the touchscreen. Any any time the resistance is at a high level, we use little animations that show proper form and technique.

Re: Launch HN: Aviron (YC W21) – High-Intensity Peloton for Rowing

#49

Post by rloomba »

ADominic wrote: post #23
AWildC182 wrote: post #13

Long time high level rower here. Why make a new rowing machine when Concept 2 is the calibration standard all athletes use and has a relatively open USB interface? For those not in the know, rowing machines all have different calibrations. C2 is the standard because they're very consistent across machines and are by far the best made allowing for many thousands of hours of use without failures. Most experienced rower…

also a former rower - I don't think we're the target market. If you've never touched an erg, it might not really matter whether you start on a C2 or not. And I'd guess controlling the hardware also gives them more control over the entire user experience + their own costs.

fwiw i'm actually not a former rower and I just purchased a C2 after some very light research. It's the industry standard, it's relatively cheap, and ALL of the apps are specifically designed or have have seamless integration with the C2.

Re: Launch HN: Aviron (YC W21) – High-Intensity Peloton for Rowing

#50

Post by FitFox »

AWildC182 wrote: post #35
FullNameAndy wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You make a good point re: the C2 market. I mentioned up top that a huge part of our experience is the electronically controlled resistance that adds up to 100+ lbs of force. Our high-intensity games and strength content, which differentiates us, requires this and the reason why we opted to build our own rower. Thanks for the feedback.

Edited my comment when I saw this. This is exceedingly dangerous. Ask any rower that's worked with people on C2 machines. Everyone will instinctively throw the damper to setting 10, then throw their back due to bad posture.

I'm a little confused by your harsh comments AWildC182. Obviously you're a fan of the C2, but isn't the point of this rower to open up a fitness experience for both new and pro users alike that's different from what's already been tried and tested in the market? I get the whole "don't fix what ain't broke" mindset, but the whole point of innovation is to broaden horizons and our experience with fitness. Plus, I saw that they have instruction videos on how to row, and just like any product, they've recommended starting on the easy levels and working your way up. Anyone that tosses themselves into the most difficult setting on anything without warming up is asking for an injury, and this goes beyond rowing.
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