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FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

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Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#131

Post by suifbwish »

caseysoftware wrote: post #74
maxerickson wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know what the framework was, but open carry wasn't allowed prior to the rally. This article quotes the police chief saying as much: https://www.kvue.com/article/news/local/protests/march-for-t... I would also expect anyone coming from the rally had been through some security screening.

Relevant data points: - Open Carry is always illegal in DC. - DC does issue concealed carry permits but doesn't honor them from other states (called reciprocity). - This was talked about far and wide in advance on Twitter, Facebook, and elsewhere framed as "don't bring guns to DC! You will go to jail!" and supported by flyers posted throughout DC. (You can still find pictures of them online.)

I believe breaking into the capitol building is also illegal so I fail to see why people who are already breaking one law would care about the others

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#132

Post by disgruntledphd2 »

VoodooJuJu wrote: post #84
gibrown wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh? Insane? The capitol was assaulted in order to prevent the democratically elected president. An actual insurrection which maybe had some attempted assassination and theft/sale of national security secrets mixed in. Seems like a pretty reasonable response.

>assault on the capitol; insurrection; attempted assassination I just want to point out the two problems with the rhetoric that mass-media and you are using to describe this event: 1. These words confer explosions, gunfire, and mass loss of life. In using these words, you are conjuring extremely violent images within the minds of your listeners. When your listeners discover the truth of the event, that the images you…

> a guy smiling and waving as he holds a podium

As a complete aside, I was amused that that photo even existed (he looks so happy with Nancy Pelosi's podium) and also completely unsurprised that he got arrested two days later.

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#133

Post by gedy »

VoodooJuJu wrote: post #84
gibrown wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh? Insane? The capitol was assaulted in order to prevent the democratically elected president. An actual insurrection which maybe had some attempted assassination and theft/sale of national security secrets mixed in. Seems like a pretty reasonable response.

>assault on the capitol; insurrection; attempted assassination I just want to point out the two problems with the rhetoric that mass-media and you are using to describe this event: 1. These words confer explosions, gunfire, and mass loss of life. In using these words, you are conjuring extremely violent images within the minds of your listeners. When your listeners discover the truth of the event, that the images you…

> If enough people keep parroting these particular words to describe this event, the meanings of these words become diluted.

Agreed, though the hyperbole and shifting definitions seems intentional and effective in many cases, you see with this with terms "hate", "racism", "white supremacy", etc as well.

When I was younger these had much more specific groups and frightening meanings! Makes me feel many using these terms so loosely today may have never run in to actual people these used to describe.

(No this is not a defense of hatred/racism/white supremacy or other bad behavior).

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#134

Post by stretchcat »

krona wrote: post #62
op00to wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Luckily, you're not a police investigator, because you can't be more wrong. All manner of weapons were confiscated - guns, ammo, explosives, crossbows, brass knuckles, etc. These were people who came to kill. https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a35214244/cap...

These were people who came to kill. Or protect themselves from counter-protesters? Are you saying anyone with a gun at the event had the mens rea for murder? There are probably more guns at the average baseball game.

I'm not sure about baseball, but the last time I went to a basketball game I had to walk through a metal detector, got my bag searched, and was patted down.

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#135

Post by mfkp »

throwaway09223 wrote: post #70
gambiting wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this....a serious question? All new iPhones are 5G compatible for the start and they sell millions, and loads of other manufacturers have released 5G compatible phones. In fact I'd risk a guess that if you bought a phone in the last 12 months it's likely to be a 5G compatible phone.

I bought a Pixel4 in March 2020 :(

Assuming you meant Pixel 4a, that one does not have 5G. The "4a 5G" model does, though, but it came out later in the year.

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#136

Post by stretchcat »

trident5000 wrote: post #78
taneq wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a good point - this is the same group that is very gun rights focused and has been wandering around the streets armed with automatic weapons. It's kind of weird to see them without guns.

Almost no civilian in the country has "automatic weapons" this is what people are saying when they mention theres a lot of hyperbole around this topic.

Slight correction: Legal automatic weapons. It is hard to estimate how many people have or could retrofit semiautomatic weapons into automatic weapons illegally. There are public plans for such modifications floating around the net, and at least some of them actually work, with some guns. And that's not counting the quasi-automatic stuff like bumpstocks or gimmicky 'trigger cranks.'

I once met somebody who wears a lightning link as a pedant around their neck. Probably it wouldn't be compatible with their rifle's receiver, but who knows.

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#137

Post by caseysoftware »

suifbwish wrote: post #130
caseysoftware wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"More guns" is right. I watched it live and then dug through the videos, selfies, etc after and inside the Capitol, I found one guy who might have had a gun. The other weapons appear to have been convenient - a fire extinguisher, flags, etc. It looks less and less like an "insurrection" and more like jackasses doing jackass things.

That’s what made it appear fake. Every republican protest recently has dozens of people carrying rifles. Why would it make sense for them not to do this when they are invading the capitol? It doesn’t add up. It’s almost as if they were not planning to really do anything except cause a diversion.

I agree with most of your reasoning but intrigued by the diversion bit. Any theories on what this was a distraction from? What got less/no attention as a result of this?

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#138

Post by nitrogen »

bilbo0s wrote: post #106
13415 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like with any other form of surveillance, if it's a bad practice, then it shouldn't be used on anyone, regardless of race.

Point is, the time to stop that particular practice was in its infancy. Waiting until the practice is both widespread and normalized is a losing strategy. The use of cell phone data is well understood, well litigated, and for all intents and purposes, settled law. To come along and unwind all that now is sisyphaean. We need to start getting out in front of the issues. Not reacting all the time. And certainly not allo…

We need to start getting out in front of the issues. Not reacting all the time.

It's kind of difficult when the privacy violations in question begin in secret. Consider police trying not to disclose their use of Stingrays, for example.

I somehow doubt police departments and intelligence agencies are going to agree to run all future uses of tech by a privacy watchdog, so how do you suggest getting ahead of the problem?

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#139

Post by quasirandom »

bilbo0s wrote: post #106
13415 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like with any other form of surveillance, if it's a bad practice, then it shouldn't be used on anyone, regardless of race.

Point is, the time to stop that particular practice was in its infancy. Waiting until the practice is both widespread and normalized is a losing strategy. The use of cell phone data is well understood, well litigated, and for all intents and purposes, settled law. To come along and unwind all that now is sisyphaean. We need to start getting out in front of the issues. Not reacting all the time. And certainly not allo…

> The use of cell phone data is well understood, well litigated, and for all intents and purposes, settled law.

I don't have strong views on the right policy outcome, but it is not accurate to call this issue well litigated and/or settled law.

Just yesterday, NYTimes ran an article about DIA claiming a "commercial availability" exception to the only Supreme Court case addressing cell phone location data (Carpenter). If that is indeed DIA's rational, they are going to have some problems. For example, it is unlawful for the state to use commercially available thermal optics to surveil the interior of a dwelling without a warrant. I think DIA may be relying on dicta from Kyllo about devices in "common use", but their rational is secret so we won't know until it is... litigated.

[1] https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/22/us/politics/dia-surveilla...

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#140

Post by olah_1 »

suifbwish wrote: post #125
olah_1 wrote: post #59

This makes me appreciate kill switches more on the librem five phone. And it also makes sense why Apple doesn’t want you to be able to fully disable wifi on your phone.

The way to disable WiFi on your device to change the password in the access point

It will still try to connect to wifi points that you happen to pass by, though.
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