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Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

nohello.net

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Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#31

Post by rascul »

ColinWright wrote: post #3

As with so much ... it depends. Sometimes when I'm working I need to chat open so I can get urgent requests and feedback. In that case it's really, really annoying for someone to pop something completely different into my feed and just baldly ask the question. It's a form of nerd-sniping[0], showing no consideration for my work mode. Better to pop in something like this: > I have a question, should take you X (second…

I prefer the person to just ask the question. If I can't handle it now, I can come back to it, if they're around. Otherwise I have to engage with them just to determine what they want, which can be time consuming, and a potential time loss if it's not something I can handle. Also, they generally have no idea how long it might take, and too often the "quick questions" tend to be anything but.

Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#33

Post by jasode »

>People who do this are generally trying to be polite by not jumping right into the request, like one would in person or on the phone - and that's great!

Different people have different reasons but I notice that many people that do a naked "hi" / "hey" are trying to see if the receiver is present for an immediate reply.

In other words, the sender deliberately wants a synchronous instead of asynchronous convo.

They don't want to type out a bunch of words for a question if the reply isn't going to happen for a few hours.

EDIT to reply: "Then send it in an email."

To clarify, some people don't want an async communication so switching to email doesn't solve their problem at all.

The issue is that some personality styles do not like sending questions into an indeterminant void. Thus, a naked "hi" for them is shorthand for "r u there to talk to me RIGHT NOW?"

I sympathize with their need for immediacy but I made a previous comment on why it drives me crazy: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17255452

Yep, some people are really confused as to why many async-preference people like me do not want to answer the phone.

Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#35

Post by mackatsol »

I don't mind that 'hello' or 'hi mackatsol' .. as I know more is coming. What drives me crazy is people who say "can I ask you a question?" I really try hard not to say "you just did".

None of those compare to those folks who do not understand that to help them we need details. How do I infer what a problem is without any details? I used to ask all sorts of questions so as to be able to help them. Now I tend to post a 'More details please! Once I have those I can help you.' What amazes me is that sometimes we get no response at all! (By we I mean those of us in the channel/group).

Note that these are co-workers who have been told many many times that we need some basic details to be able to do anything at all, like a client's domain name, or a client id in our CMS.

Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#36

Post by xuhu »

StavrosK wrote: post #11
ColinWright wrote: post #3

As with so much ... it depends. Sometimes when I'm working I need to chat open so I can get urgent requests and feedback. In that case it's really, really annoying for someone to pop something completely different into my feed and just baldly ask the question. It's a form of nerd-sniping[0], showing no consideration for my work mode. Better to pop in something like this: > I have a question, should take you X (second…

I, too, am puzzled by your downvotes. > In that case it's really, really annoying for someone to pop something completely different into my feed and just baldly ask the question Why? Can't you just reply whenever you can?

After someone spent 15 minutes typing a wall of text, it might be rude if you ignore it. Them asking first allows you to tell them to hold off until later.

Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#37

Post by ColinWright »

bsmithers wrote: post #17
ColinWright wrote: post #3

As with so much ... it depends. Sometimes when I'm working I need to chat open so I can get urgent requests and feedback. In that case it's really, really annoying for someone to pop something completely different into my feed and just baldly ask the question. It's a form of nerd-sniping[0], showing no consideration for my work mode. Better to pop in something like this: > I have a question, should take you X (second…

I think it's on you - as the receiver of a message - to appropriately deal with your messaging app of choice such that it doesn't interupt your flow. Otherwise, you are placing an impossible burden on the sender of the message to some how telepathically know if it's a good time. IMHO, your preferred workflow makes it seem that your time is more valuable than the other person's as you're now asking them to hang around…

That's why I say "It Depends". If I'm working I've already set my system to say (a) I'm working, and (b) only receive from colleagues. Then they can choose to wait (because I'm working), ping me (because they will need a response when I get a break), or ask now (because they need the answer now).

If their judgement turns out not to match my expectation then we can talk later about priorities, and each adjust to the other, thus improving the working relationship.

> IMHO, your preferred workflow makes it seem that your time is more valuable than the other person's as you're now asking them to hang around waiting until they can actually ask their question.

Not at all, there is a balance. Sometimes what I'm doing really is more important than answering their question, sometimes it isn't. If what I'm doing is more important, then simply blurting the question into my message stream, as suggested by the article, is a "Bad Thing(tm)".

That's why I say ... "It Depends". I believe it depends on the question you want to ask, and the current working context.

Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#38

Post by eel »

Prior to extended remote work, I used to feel this way when people just sent a single hello. But now I use it as an invitation to make small talk. So if someone just says hello, I start asking them questions: how's it going, how's is , etc. This makes some people go straight to their original question, but I think it also helps both of us feel a little more connected while everyone is remote.

Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#39

Post by dfboyd »

I am the original author of the document this document was based on. It was an internal Wiki page at Google written when I was an SRE. After I wrote the original page, someone put up an internal shortlink at "go/nohello". After I left Google, someone took the Wiki page content and [illegally, since it was Google confidential, simply from being on the internal Wiki], and put it up on the net at "nohello.com". The linked article at nohello.net is a paraphrase of the nohello.com content; compare the list of salutations (especially "yt?) and the paragraphs at the end mentioning "asynchronous communication". ("yt?" was a favorite of Raymond B---., who was in many ways my mentor at Google and who I'm forever grateful to.)

Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#40

Post by mackatsol »

jasode wrote: post #33

>People who do this are generally trying to be polite by not jumping right into the request, like one would in person or on the phone - and that's great! Different people have different reasons but I notice that many people that do a naked "hi" / "hey" are trying to see if the receiver is present for an immediate reply. In other words, the sender deliberately wants a synchronous instead of asynchronous convo. They do…

Thank you. I never thought of it that way before. Much appreciated.
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