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One hull crack located in ISS, another one suspected

tass.com

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Re: One hull crack located in ISS, another one suspected

#51

Post by snoshy »

spike021 wrote: post #32

Not a big space person, but this makes me wonder: why have we not planned for a new ISS? We must have better tech nowadays from all the working countries/groups currently involved, plus SpaceX and other space companies' backing that would not have existed as it does now back when this ISS was first designed/created.

Largely because it's a fantastically expensive undertaking, and hasn't quite borne out the fruits that were speculated about over the years. USA provides a huge bulk of the funding, expertise, and personnel required to keep the program running. That's not to say that Russia, Canada, Japan, etc. don't do their part, but it's really not as much of a truly global joint effort as you might be led to believe.

Then there's a genuine question of what this enormous expenditure truly buys us. NASA's budget has been strangled for decades now, and robotic probes and missions to other planets have been perennially delayed due to cost, while their scientific ROI would truly be much greater than for ISS experiments in many cases. Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge fan of the ISS and manned spaceflight in general, but this kind of money does require serious explanation to Congress to justify the costs. Oh, and there's the entire money pit that is Artemis/SLS that stays on NASA books.

Also, why now? The private space industry is at what seems to be the beginning of an inflection point with heavy launch capabilities (SpaceX Starship) looking likely to drive down costs by over an order of magnitude. A single Starship might provide 800 cubic meters of volume, and the whole ISS is 1,000 cubic meters. Why not wait for that to come online and then launch many many ISS' worth of volume to several labs?

Lastly, the privatization of launch vehicles in particular has a lot of people questioning if private industry might be better able to step up to this challenge of manned orbiting labs. It has a potential to expand the range of solutions, massively decrease costs, and provide efficiencies that NASA might not be able to provide. When you don't have to manufacture space parts scattered all across the globe, it's easy to see why this could be cheaper and more efficient.

Re: One hull crack located in ISS, another one suspected

#52

Post by qayxc »

renewiltord wrote: post #45
spike021 wrote: post #32

Not a big space person, but this makes me wonder: why have we not planned for a new ISS? We must have better tech nowadays from all the working countries/groups currently involved, plus SpaceX and other space companies' backing that would not have existed as it does now back when this ISS was first designed/created.

When Starship comes online, building a thing like this will be hecka fast.

Nope - there'll be not much difference.

It's not just the getting things into space that's the hard and costly part. Modules take years to design, build, and test.

That's why the current trend moves towards ever smaller and thus cheaper satellites and big launchers like Delta IV Heavy, Ariane 5, and Falcon Heavy barely see any action at all.

Starship would enable single-launch space stations, yes. But there are no single-launch space station designs yet and building one will either take time (ISS/MIR) or end up being much more expensive per person day due to weak design (e.g. Skylab).

Re: One hull crack located in ISS, another one suspected

#53

Post by enraged_camel »

qayxc wrote: post #52
renewiltord wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When Starship comes online, building a thing like this will be hecka fast.

Nope - there'll be not much difference. It's not just the getting things into space that's the hard and costly part. Modules take years to design, build, and test. That's why the current trend moves towards ever smaller and thus cheaper satellites and big launchers like Delta IV Heavy, Ariane 5, and Falcon Heavy barely see any action at all. Starship would enable single-launch space stations, yes. But there are no si…

>> It's not just the getting things into space that's the hard and costly part. Modules take years to design, build, and test.

Using the traditional approach, yes. But SpaceX is proving that there are other approaches that yield fruit far faster and also for drastically less money.

Re: One hull crack located in ISS, another one suspected

#54

Post by ska »

lsllc wrote: post #42
ChuckMcM wrote: post #2

Materials aging in space is a pretty deep subject. That it is the Russian Zvevda module that is leaking/cracking is likely related to the fact that it is also the oldest module in the ISS. The ISS is/was scheduled to be retired in 2024 (aka 3 years from now) but there are calls to keep it going. My fantasy would be to have SpaceX move it into the Lunar L1 Lagrange point which would keep it in use but it would have to…

I think we need a "Space New Deal", I'm honestly saddened by the lack of progress in space in my lifetime. I mean we've done some great work, but we haven't made any giant leaps since getting to the moon 51.5 years ago. Thankfully, we do have SpaceX et. al. who really are making some big strides -- but how do we multiply & speed up that effort? ... sorry, I'm being selfish, but I really want to go to Mars.

> but how do we multiply & speed up that effort?

I think it's pretty much politically impossible. The first big space push was mostly a political pissing match (i.e. not really driven by doing it for its own sake). It's pretty easy to come up with other major challenges that most people will consider more important that also aren't getting funding ... so private industry looks more likely to get some traction. States might get interested if/when those efforts start to get more interesting or threatening.

Mars in your lifetime is implausible, but not impossible I suppose.

Re: One hull crack located in ISS, another one suspected

#55

Post by StillBored »

analog31 wrote: post #3

I hope JB Weld and Shoe Goo work in space, or our hopes of interstellar travel are dashed.

I'm betting on something closer to "slime" the stuff they put in tubeless mountain bikes. Or at least I don't know why the thing isn't built with an inner self sealant. If nothing else if its made with a bit of florescent die locating leaks becomes as simple as looking for the glowing spot on the outside.

Re: One hull crack located in ISS, another one suspected

#56

Post by xxpor »

tempestn wrote: post #16
xxpor wrote: post #11

Are Tass articles always translated this poorly? I'm just surprised that a state owned news agency would put something like this out.

Are you sure it was a translation? I assumed it was quoting Solovyov speaking English.

It's not even the interview that's the issue, the actual text the author wrote is a mess too.

>He underscored that air loss due to the crack are insignificant.

>In November, Russian cosmonauts photographed the suspected leak location on the outside of the ISS, but found no hull damage at where the crack is supposed to be.

Granted, it's understandable, but it sounds like someone who learned English in school but never really uses it rather than someone paid to translate.

Re: One hull crack located in ISS, another one suspected

#58

Post by Rebelgecko »

akiselev wrote: post #10
ChuckMcM wrote: post #2

Materials aging in space is a pretty deep subject. That it is the Russian Zvevda module that is leaking/cracking is likely related to the fact that it is also the oldest module in the ISS. The ISS is/was scheduled to be retired in 2024 (aka 3 years from now) but there are calls to keep it going. My fantasy would be to have SpaceX move it into the Lunar L1 Lagrange point which would keep it in use but it would have to…

> That it is the Russian Zvevda module that is leaking/cracking is likely related to the fact that it is also the oldest module in the ISS. Definitely sounds like it. They can't identify the leak on the inside so it doesn't sound like a micrometeoroid impact and they suspect a second leak that is so small they need a microscope to verify: > "So far, we have found one place and suspect another, where as some kind of l…

I would imagine that there's also some temperature swings on the skin of the ISS

Re: One hull crack located in ISS, another one suspected

#59

Post by ghostpepper »

lsllc wrote: post #42
ChuckMcM wrote: post #2

Materials aging in space is a pretty deep subject. That it is the Russian Zvevda module that is leaking/cracking is likely related to the fact that it is also the oldest module in the ISS. The ISS is/was scheduled to be retired in 2024 (aka 3 years from now) but there are calls to keep it going. My fantasy would be to have SpaceX move it into the Lunar L1 Lagrange point which would keep it in use but it would have to…

I think we need a "Space New Deal", I'm honestly saddened by the lack of progress in space in my lifetime. I mean we've done some great work, but we haven't made any giant leaps since getting to the moon 51.5 years ago. Thankfully, we do have SpaceX et. al. who really are making some big strides -- but how do we multiply & speed up that effort? ... sorry, I'm being selfish, but I really want to go to Mars.

What does "new deal" mean in this context? Large amount of public funding?
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