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Android Ported to RISC-V

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Re: Android Ported to RISC-V

#31

Post by kls »

literallycancer wrote: post #25
dkjaudyeqooe wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> exploiting cheap labour to brute-force their way into the market. Do you mean like slavery in the United States?

Slavery resulted in zero pressure to innovate and industrialize and was the number 1 reason why the South had a garbage economy.

was the number 1 reason why the South had a garbage economy

I am not sure what the implication of garbage economy is, but the south was fairly wealthy antebellum. So much so that they supported a large tax base for the federal government which they resented, it lead to the nullification crisis in 1832 and started the long road to the civil war. Southern universities where also considered to be some of the best in the nation pre-war.

If you where referring to an economy based on the backs of slaves then yes it could be labeled a garbage economy but if it is in reference to the poverty seen across the south in modern day, the antebellum south was a totally different economy and honestly an entirely foreign culture a culture that was decimated (the bad and good parts) in Reconstruction.

Re: Android Ported to RISC-V

#32

Post by nix23 »

numpad0 wrote: post #20
varispeed wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you know that nothing stops them from rounding up engineers are move them to a camp with an order to develop certain technology in exchange for bread and water and that their families will live? Soviet Union for example used to build entire cities where they crammed engineers from all over the Union, however rather than being exploited, the engineers had special privileges. But that easily could change with a stro…

There is sense of mystique associated with the Soviet Union but the best they managed to build were AKs, Soyuz, Chernobyl, all interesting and robust in its own ways but not all that competitive in terms of performance, so,

>all interesting and robust in its own ways but not all that competitive in terms of performance, so,

Really? The most performing rocket-engine for a long time was the Russian RD-170. The most impressive performing Fighter (aeronautic wise the Su-27) The fastest Sub also Russian, the biggest ICBM (R-36M) too and so on.

>best they managed to build were AKs, Soyuz, Chernobyl

The US did Agent Orange, Fat Man and Apollo 1, was that the best the US manged to build?

Re: Android Ported to RISC-V

#33

Post by zozbot234 »

kls wrote: post #31
literallycancer wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Slavery resulted in zero pressure to innovate and industrialize and was the number 1 reason why the South had a garbage economy.

was the number 1 reason why the South had a garbage economy I am not sure what the implication of garbage economy is, but the south was fairly wealthy antebellum. So much so that they supported a large tax base for the federal government which they resented, it lead to the nullification crisis in 1832 and started the long road to the civil war. Southern universities where also considered to be some of the best in the…

> the south was fairly wealthy antebellum.

Not so much when you properly account for the enslaved population. It's just not sensible to only count free citizens, that's clearly a misleading impression.

Re: Android Ported to RISC-V

#34

Post by varispeed »

littlestymaar wrote: post #28
varispeed wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They could copy and paste laws that are used for illegal drugs enforcement - just replace drugs with Android from China and then force other countries to support that.

> They could copy and paste laws that are used for illegal drugs enforcement Given how well it worked, I'm not sure it's a great path to follow… > then force other countries to support that. Well, that's where it becomes interesting. Where are those countries supposed to get their Android phones from? Samsung cannot double their Android phone production. And what if China responded by not allowing the China-made iPho…

Just to be clear - I am not advocating that, just I am thinking out loud what not-right-in-the-head politicians (as they usually are) could do to get that way. The easiest way is to apply the same framework to a different thing and then hope it will come to an equilibrium by itself eventually. For that you would also need a good chunk of propaganda in the tune of drugs are bad, just say no, saying phones from China are bad and then subsidise companies who are manufacturing in the west and heavily tax stuff with Chinese origin and so on. I am talking about about decade worth of slow transformation. Fortunately for China they are so corrupt just like our politicians, that any attempt to do this could be thwarted with money under the table. They managed to do this with drugs because you had no cartels and any organisation selling or manufacturing drugs wouldn't have enough money to influence the government (and ironically they got so rich because of essentially tax free high margin product that they pay for "war on drugs" to continue). Try that with Apple that essentially can do whatever they like.

Re: Android Ported to RISC-V

#35

Post by f00zz »

nix23 wrote: post #32
numpad0 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is sense of mystique associated with the Soviet Union but the best they managed to build were AKs, Soyuz, Chernobyl, all interesting and robust in its own ways but not all that competitive in terms of performance, so,

>all interesting and robust in its own ways but not all that competitive in terms of performance, so, Really? The most performing rocket-engine for a long time was the Russian RD-170. The most impressive performing Fighter (aeronautic wise the Su-27) The fastest Sub also Russian, the biggest ICBM (R-36M) too and so on. >best they managed to build were AKs, Soyuz, Chernobyl The US did Agent Orange, Fat Man and Apollo…

Most Soviet computers were shoddy copies of Western models. DEC even left Easter eggs in Cyrillic on their silicon to Russian reverse-engineers:

https://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/creatures/pages/russians.html

Re: Android Ported to RISC-V

#36

Post by nix23 »

f00zz wrote: post #35
nix23 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>all interesting and robust in its own ways but not all that competitive in terms of performance, so, Really? The most performing rocket-engine for a long time was the Russian RD-170. The most impressive performing Fighter (aeronautic wise the Su-27) The fastest Sub also Russian, the biggest ICBM (R-36M) too and so on. >best they managed to build were AKs, Soyuz, Chernobyl The US did Agent Orange, Fat Man and Apollo…

Most Soviet computers were shoddy copies of Western models. DEC even left Easter eggs in Cyrillic on their silicon to Russian reverse-engineers: https://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/creatures/pages/russians.html

But Computers are not everything. The US did some good tec but the SU too, it's not just black and white.

Re: Android Ported to RISC-V

#37

Post by sharpneli »

coldtea wrote: post #17
d3ckard wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's good though. That means they have to invest in R&D instead of depending on exploiting cheap labour to brute-force their way into the market. If they invest in R&D, they need creative people who are up to date. Such people tend to bring change to the society at large(I'd say democracy is really good for creativeness to flourish). Basically, the goal is not to expunge them from the market, the goal is to make th…

> That's good though. That means they have to invest in R&D instead of depending on exploiting cheap labour to brute-force their way into the market. Using cheap labor, copying foreign products, and bypassing copyright worked for the US, Japan, Korea, and Taiwan when they were in their own economic rise, and thus far has been working for China. > Basically, the goal is not to expunge them from the market, the goal is…

> Using cheap labor, copying foreign products, and bypassing copyright worked for the US, Japan, Korea, and Taiwan when they were in their own economic rise, and thus far has been working for China.

That's what makes the arguments from USA so amusing.

I mean they basically nicked, against British law, the designs how to mass manufacture textiles. Is US willing to repay, with interest, all the economic damage that did to British industry? Same with all the later patents. US basically started respecting patents of others when they got to the point that they had more of their own. So only when it was profitable.

It's basically "It's fine when I do it but now that I'm the big dominant power everyone else must stay in line and let me stay dominant"

Don't get me wrong. I'm happy that US did what it did. I'm also happy that the other countries did what they did, because in the end we all benefit more from the countries being more developed than being less developed by "following the rules". Once China gets bit more R&D of their own they will start following the rules simply because it's mostly reciprocal.

Re: Android Ported to RISC-V

#38

Post by hakeberio »

coldtea wrote: post #17
d3ckard wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's good though. That means they have to invest in R&D instead of depending on exploiting cheap labour to brute-force their way into the market. If they invest in R&D, they need creative people who are up to date. Such people tend to bring change to the society at large(I'd say democracy is really good for creativeness to flourish). Basically, the goal is not to expunge them from the market, the goal is to make th…

> That's good though. That means they have to invest in R&D instead of depending on exploiting cheap labour to brute-force their way into the market. Using cheap labor, copying foreign products, and bypassing copyright worked for the US, Japan, Korea, and Taiwan when they were in their own economic rise, and thus far has been working for China. > Basically, the goal is not to expunge them from the market, the goal is…

Developed/rich countries "kicking away the ladder" from developing countries is a well-known concept- there's an interesting book by the same title by Ha-joon Chang.

To be clear, I'm not saying that any of these actions are justified.

Re: Android Ported to RISC-V

#39

Post by ant6n »

zozbot234 wrote: post #33
kls wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

was the number 1 reason why the South had a garbage economy I am not sure what the implication of garbage economy is, but the south was fairly wealthy antebellum. So much so that they supported a large tax base for the federal government which they resented, it lead to the nullification crisis in 1832 and started the long road to the civil war. Southern universities where also considered to be some of the best in the…

> the south was fairly wealthy antebellum. Not so much when you properly account for the enslaved population. It's just not sensible to only count free citizens, that's clearly a misleading impression.

Let’s make a compromise and count three-fifths.

Re: Android Ported to RISC-V

#40

Post by SirLotsaLocks »

throwaway4good wrote: post #9
einpoklum wrote: post #5

It is actually worrying that there will be a push to run a Google-dependent platform on RISC-V's. After all, we know that a lot of functionality is closed into Google Play Services, so that AOSP is to a great extent a bait for being fully tied to Google. Even without relying on closed-source components, you're still relying on Google's interest and good will in maintaining that project. Instead, it's much more import…

There is Huawei HarmonyOS which I believe aims to be compatible with Android mobile apps but has a different kernel and is not reliant on Google mobile services.

I'm excited to see where HarmonyOS goes. If google had to compete with another mobile OS it would be interesting to see what they do.
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