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DDoS-Guard to forfeit internet space occupied by Parler

krebsonsecurity.com

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Re: DDoS-Guard to forfeit internet space occupied by Parler

#121

Post by sonotathrowaway »

grayfaced wrote: post #82
squibbles wrote: post #10

> The pending disruption for DDoS-Guard and Parler comes compliments of Ron Guilmette, a researcher who has made it something of a personal mission to de-platform conspiracy theorist and far-right groups. While this may solve immediate problems (such as the planning of unlawful or otherwise socially harmful events), we should consider the long-term impacts of de-platforming. Does censorship, even if justified, fuel a…

Too soon to say on this current round. But it's generally considered to have been an effective strategy in dealing with Isis and Al Qaeda. But that was a combined campaign to eliminate recruitment by de-platforming, and eliminate existing membership militarily. It's possible de-platforming these domestic groups will just further radicalize the existing members. But it should inhibit their growth.

There’s good data to show that deplatforming did wonders for Reddit in reducing the amount of hate speech and harassment that flowed across their platform. Similarly, deplatforming 8chan has done wonders in reducing the amount of mass murderers they inspire.

I think a dispassionate analysis would dispel the idea that it’s not effective, and most such arguments are fueled more by emotion than objective facts.

Re: DDoS-Guard to forfeit internet space occupied by Parler

#122

Post by rhizome »

squibbles wrote: post #10

> The pending disruption for DDoS-Guard and Parler comes compliments of Ron Guilmette, a researcher who has made it something of a personal mission to de-platform conspiracy theorist and far-right groups. While this may solve immediate problems (such as the planning of unlawful or otherwise socially harmful events), we should consider the long-term impacts of de-platforming. Does censorship, even if justified, fuel a…

This isn't censorship, and saying that it is censorship is a bad-faith tell or a sign of naivete. Furthermore, these people are already angry and distrustful, so how much of a movement's psychoses should the commercial world be forced to accomodate?

Fringe groups have options they've always had: colo and common-carrier lines into their own server/racks/datacenter. Only thing missing is talent, which is nobody's problem but theirs.

Re: DDoS-Guard to forfeit internet space occupied by Parler

#123

Post by rhizome »

sonotathrowaway wrote: post #121
grayfaced wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Too soon to say on this current round. But it's generally considered to have been an effective strategy in dealing with Isis and Al Qaeda. But that was a combined campaign to eliminate recruitment by de-platforming, and eliminate existing membership militarily. It's possible de-platforming these domestic groups will just further radicalize the existing members. But it should inhibit their growth.

There’s good data to show that deplatforming did wonders for Reddit in reducing the amount of hate speech and harassment that flowed across their platform. Similarly, deplatforming 8chan has done wonders in reducing the amount of mass murderers they inspire. I think a dispassionate analysis would dispel the idea that it’s not effective, and most such arguments are fueled more by emotion than objective facts.

Milo was wiped off the map of public consciousness, which is good evidence for the effectiveness of deplatforming in itself.

Re: DDoS-Guard to forfeit internet space occupied by Parler

#124

Post by thorwasdfasdf »

this is vigilante justice.

Is it a good idea for Facebook, amazon and random researchers on the web to hand out internet death sentences (as judge, jury and executioner)? without even any kind of due process?

this is setting a potentially dangerous precedent going forward.

having the FBI take the site down would be one thing but having FB or amazon or other sites do it without any kind of due process just seems wrong. what if they make a mistake? what if they don't do without biases?

Re: DDoS-Guard to forfeit internet space occupied by Parler

#125

Post by [deleted] »

sleepysysadmin wrote: post #72
ABeeSea wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These groups are already generating social conflict. De-platforming ISIS from Twitter and YouTube worked to stop their massive growth of new members through propaganda. There is no reason to believe it won’t also work on American right-wing terrorist and Christian terrorists. “Capitol Hill Attack Video Shows Rioters Pray With Lifted Hands After Violating Senate Chamber” https://faithfullymagazine.com/capitol-hill-att…

>These groups are already generating social conflict. De-platforming ISIS from Twitter and YouTube worked to stop their massive growth of new members through propaganda. There is no reason to believe it won’t also work on American right-wing and Christian terrorists. If I am following this correctly. The American right-wing(republicans) is equivalent to a terrorist organization that beheads people amongst other war c…

[deleted]

Re: DDoS-Guard to forfeit internet space occupied by Parler

#126

Post by dragonwriter »

kube-system wrote: post #31
richardARPANET wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you praising someone with too much time on their hands attempting to limit freedom of speech? Really sad and pathetic.

Deplatforming is a freedom of association issue.

> Deplatforming is a freedom of association issue.

Its a freedom of speech issue: The right to choose what speech one will expend one’s resources promoting.

Re: DDoS-Guard to forfeit internet space occupied by Parler

#127

Post by sonotathrowaway »

swebs wrote: post #61
judge2020 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Parler isn't a bastion of free speech. They make the same "we don't want to be associated with certain users" decision that FB and Twitter do, often in the exact same ways. They just don't ban or limit far-right conspiracy.

So should we also cancel sites like Twitter that don't ban far-left conspiracy?

If those far-left conspiracists are using the platform to coordinate terrorist attacks, absolutely.

Re: DDoS-Guard to forfeit internet space occupied by Parler

#128

Post by zamadatix »

marmada wrote: post #114

To people who complain about deplatforming Parler, how would you feel about de-platforming a forum to recruit members for ISIS, or the Taliban? To me, Parler has equivalencies - AWS linked to calls for violence that were made on Parler - The platform was actively suppressing non-conservative viewpoints I would recommend looking at r/ParlerWatch on Reddit

I don't think suppression of thoughts based on regional majority opinion is a net good or a reliable method of dealing with extremism, violence, or people we just don't like. Not only does what's acceptable vary by region but each region is unlikely to agree with itself from 100 years ago. That's not a knock on popular opinion it's just a knock on using it to decide what's acceptable to discuss as it's clearly not consistent. Some say violence is the separator except there seems to be plenty of acceptance of "good violence" whenever it's not the minority opinion doing it so again it doesn't seem like a consistent way to decide what's good to discuss.

I hold the opinion that the only successful way to navigate to stability is education, open discourse, and constant discourse. The more in society that ignore other thoughts because they are convinced they are unequivocally correct on what's right or wrong (minority or majority) the more unstable society is going to be as they are driven to view everyone who thinks differently as the problem instead of searching for better answers.

Re: DDoS-Guard to forfeit internet space occupied by Parler

#129

Post by IronWolve »

ABeeSea wrote: post #77
lettergram wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And BLM & ANTIFA use Facebook and Twitter? We banning those? It’s insane to say “because “terrorists” use Twitter, let’s shutdown Twitter” instead we remove them from the platform. Parlor was working with the FBI and was kicking people off their platform breaking their terms. It makes no sense what’s currently happening.

I’m looking through the @blklivesmatter Twitter account and I don’t see any calls to violence. Can you point me to one? https://mobile.twitter.com/Blklivesmatter

Twitter just removed a bunch of Antifa, after the last few days of violence, and twitter was not deplatformed.

https://twitter.com/MrAndyNgo/status/1352399672594345985

Re: DDoS-Guard to forfeit internet space occupied by Parler

#130

Post by plugger »

marmada wrote: post #114

To people who complain about deplatforming Parler, how would you feel about de-platforming a forum to recruit members for ISIS, or the Taliban? To me, Parler has equivalencies - AWS linked to calls for violence that were made on Parler - The platform was actively suppressing non-conservative viewpoints I would recommend looking at r/ParlerWatch on Reddit

+1. I must admit I find it a bit rich that people are raising free speech issues around this situation. I find myself wondering where these people were in 2014 when all the major social media platforms systematically removed ISIS accounts and content from their systems. I don't recall anyone lamenting that move and the chilling effects it had on free speech. In fact, iirc the response was quite the opposite.
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