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New Intel CEO rehiring retired CPU architects

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Re: New Intel CEO rehiring retired CPU architects

#301

Post by cascom »

giantg2 wrote: post #165
bryant wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For unsteady contracted project work, this doesn't sound off the mark for high-value niche skillsets at a senior or principal level. I wouldn't expect FAANGs to pay it for steady work, though. Well, Netflix might come close. I can count two principal-level architects pulling north of 700k/y, but I doubt they work just 40 hours a week.

I just have trouble wrapping my head around how someone can be that valuable. I'll never even hit $75/hr (excluding inflation).

Your comparing apples and oranges - when you take a salary you take a lower hourly wage to eliminate volume risk, works in the spot market get compensated for taking the volume risk

Re: New Intel CEO rehiring retired CPU architects

#302

Post by munk-a »

Swizec wrote: post #292
lmilcin wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is a little bit more complicated than that. If the webapp can solve $5000/day problem but there is literally millions of people that can do this, you are certainly not getting a share of that. Somebody else is maybe going to be rewarded for spotting an opportunity but the most you get is a "market rate". The only way you can get paid proportionally is if you are literally the only one that can solve the problem an…

Yes but that’s for the company to argue. Why would you help them lower your compensation? Your goal is to maximize the value delivered. Their goal is to minimize how much of the value you capture. You’ll find balance somewhere in the middle. And ultimately there’s only so much a company will pay if they can’t extract value out of your work. Regardless of how good you are.

I think this is where society comes into play - Ideally I'd like to see the company expend a large amount of that value into wages with only a proportion of that going to developers and the rest being eaten off as taxes that can be put toward social programs to help the less well off.

Re: New Intel CEO rehiring retired CPU architects

#303

Post by wikibob »

flyinglizard wrote: post #286
0xffff2 wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some people don't care so much about the money. I'm barely over the six figure mark in the bay area. I could probably make a lot more money somewhere else, but I wouldn't get to do anything nearly as interesting as my current work.

What if I told you that, more often than not, you could do your current work and get much more money? People, especially tech people, are quite awful at extracting their full value.

Fully agree. For some reason people assume that you get paid more in order to deal with less interesting work or a worse work environment.

This is completely false.

You get paid more when the company values you more.

The company values you more, when they make more from what you are able to contribute, on average.

Highly paid engineering work environments are strongly correlated with interesting work and with good working conditions.

Re: New Intel CEO rehiring retired CPU architects

#304

Post by dan-robertson »

nolok wrote: post #125
sradman wrote: post #78

In my estimation, Intel has four categories in which it is being outperformed by key competitors: 1. TSMC/Samsung - fabrication 2. AMD/Amazon-Graviton - Cloud Server 3. Apple-M1/AMD - Laptop 4. Nvidia/Amazon - Cloud ML/DL Accelerator Intel has made giant blunders in the past (e.g. Itanium [1], Atom [2], WiMAX [3]) but I'm not sure that any of these past challenges were equivalent to the current four-front war. I woul…

You forgot their main market, AMD - desktop x86/windows But the first point on your list is where their real loss is, it's historically the source of their strenght and they've never been losing at this one.

Is that their main market? It’s surely what they’re known for to the general public but I’d have guessed they care more about the Xeon line. But I’d be interested to hear that I’m wrong.

Re: New Intel CEO rehiring retired CPU architects

#305

Post by cbozeman »

avs733 wrote: post #280
cbozeman wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> I walked out the door of Intel one day in 2011 (longer and irrelevant story). I am extremely interested in this long and irrelevant story.

The things I say when I open my mouth... Graduated with my MS and three internships with Intel into what I thought would be my 'rest of life' job. I wanted Brian's job, which at that point was the head of the fabs. Got less than one month of training and then told 'all yours now'. Worked my ass off for like 18 months, made a name for myself in the factory, was literally on call 24x7 by myself for 11 months. Got an an…

Well this turned a little darker than I originally thought.

I discovered a kid out in Utah on YouTube named Joshua Fluke and his story is very similar to yours, and he often says much of what you say in terms of quality of life, the corporate attitude of most companies, etc.

I've only ever worked for someone else twice in my life (I considered military service to be just that - serving the nation, not so much "working" for the American people, although I suppose one could make that argument), so many of these tales are pretty foreign to me, and since I also have "fuck you" money now, they're made all the stranger to me that anyone would tolerate such behavior. I don't accept the, "I have bills to pay," mantra - to me its more akin to, "Either you respect yourself or you don't."

EDIT: Glad to see you did come to respect yourself in a healthy way.

Re: New Intel CEO rehiring retired CPU architects

#306

Post by alrs »

cbozeman wrote: post #171
hobofan wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Damn, that whole comment section is an amazing time capsule of sentiment regarding Microsoft and other tech companies! Well worth a read.

This comment is amazing... "Microsoft recently came to my graduate school to recruit for user experience design and user experience research positions. 10 folks out of my program (about 25% of us) scored and interview. Every single one of us had no intention of working for Microsoft and joked about it intensely. Microsoft had be relegated to the realm of other boring places to do our type of work but that you intervi…

Microsoft has been on the 1.0-is-useless, 3.0-is-tolerable track for over thirty years. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_3.0

Re: New Intel CEO rehiring retired CPU architects

#307

Post by FuckButtons »

cambalache wrote: post #220
fermienrico wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This feels like a distraction from what I was driving at. Whether it’s Intel, AMD, etc. any large company needs a lot of work to be done. You don’t need top engineers for that.

You are confusing "top" engineers/employees with top-technical employees, that is not the same at all. If you staff a company with geniuses in R&D and gray mediocrities in all the other departments I am pretty sure you know what will happen. You want great CAD designers, PM, QA, logistics, marketing people? Pay them accordingly and not like mediocrities.It is pretty obvious you have no idea what you are talking about…

Either that or he is unwittingly expressing the underlying problem with intel's corporate culture that got them into this mess.

Re: New Intel CEO rehiring retired CPU architects

#308

Post by cbozeman »

cccc4all wrote: post #299
msie wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm in the same boat. The way some people here talk about making $200/hour makes me think how out of touch some HN'ers are with the average worker.

$200/hour rate is median for developers with in demand skills. Many companies will gladly pay this and higher rates to fill positions with qualified candidates. Software engineering and development field is extremely difficult. There are many opportunities in this field, because there are so few candidates that can do the work. HN is self selected group of people with experience in the field. But they are actually ve…

I think this is still an oversimplification of what's actually going on.

Its not so much that the skills themselves are in demand, its the enormous experience that someone who can command that kind of fee has. The skill set you're talking about can be learned probably in a year or two of 8-5, M-F self-guided learning from Udemy / Coursera / YouTube, but its the experience of using those skills to build something of value that is driving that hourly rate, not so much the skills themselves.

If you feel I'm missing something here, please go into more depth, because I find this all quite fascinating. :)

Re: New Intel CEO rehiring retired CPU architects

#309

Post by brandmeyer »

whymauri wrote: post #229
Goosee wrote: post #89

A bit off topic but I remember when Intel set up a special career fair presentation for my major. I forget the specific role the manager was hiring for, but it sounded like a quality/reliability engineer. Basically run a bunch of tests, identify and analyze errors on newly manufactured equipment. I immediately lost interest when the manager said the role would either work until 9 PM or start the next day at 4 AM due…

It's incredible to me how often recruiters will shoot themselves in the foot when discussing WLB. When I was an undergrad, I had a lot of management consultancies reach out for technical/engineering roles. I thought - hey, there's a reason why people want to work at Bain, BCG, and McKinsey, right? So I spoke to a recruiter and opened with: so what's the work life balance look like for technical ICs at your company? T…

> It's incredible to me how often recruiters will shoot themselves in the foot when discussing WLB.

Would you prefer them to lie to you? At least the recruiter was honest, even if the company's WLB was poor.

Re: New Intel CEO rehiring retired CPU architects

#310

Post by Swizec »

munk-a wrote: post #302
Swizec wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes but that’s for the company to argue. Why would you help them lower your compensation? Your goal is to maximize the value delivered. Their goal is to minimize how much of the value you capture. You’ll find balance somewhere in the middle. And ultimately there’s only so much a company will pay if they can’t extract value out of your work. Regardless of how good you are.

I think this is where society comes into play - Ideally I'd like to see the company expend a large amount of that value into wages with only a proportion of that going to developers and the rest being eaten off as taxes that can be put toward social programs to help the less well off.

We are in agreement. But if companies pay just market salary with no regard to value created, then they are not expending a large amount of value on wages :)
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