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Why do we assume extraterrestrials might want to visit us?

scientificamerican.com

191–200 of 299 posts

Re: Why do we assume extraterrestrials might want to visit us?

#191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We study ants too... Go to the ant, thou sluggard; Consider her ways, and be wise

99.99% of ant colonies are not been studied. And for 0.01% we do study, we don't care of them seeing us. > Consider her ways, and be wise There is no philosophy to extract from ant society. Pretty dystopian, totalitarian, and despotic.

Ants work exclusively for the common good of the colony. That's my kind of dystopia.

Re: Why do we assume extraterrestrials might want to visit us?

#192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a very interesting point that I hadn't noticed before. Of course, this relies on assuming (believing?) the universe is a giant simulation run on a computer with limited resources. I did not get your last sentence though. Could you elaborate?

Rules of the universe appear to us relatively simple. But the question of numerical stability is not solved specially for later times. In physics it is natural to start from an initial state and integrate through time, starting from initial time and evolving by time-stepping. Physics helps but this doesn't prevent the emergence of numerical instabilities like a big-computer being built. So if you were running a unive…

> From the perspective of a being inside the universe, the only thing we could observe by such a parameter search on the spaces of possible universe, are being amazed at how some constants of the universe seem to be fine-tuned.

That's a good point, and I've also always wondered how fine-tuned those constants are. One problem though, is that changing the initial parameters would most likely have chaotic effects as the system (the whole universe) seems unstable and fragile. For example, it would be extremely difficult to fine-tune the parameters such that billions of years later at this moment, I don't write this comment.

Re: Why do we assume extraterrestrials might want to visit us?

#193
post #82
post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We might as well be among the first ones. I find the idea quite fascinating, it kind of puts the Earth back into the center and makes us special in a way.

If we are the first, then its likely the 'great filter' is behind us. And it means we will never find life that isn't related to us.

I can't quite follow how the "early bloomers" theory would imply either of those two conclusions. What I meant is the concept that our galaxy is young and the conditions just became right for ingelligent life to form, and here we are.

Re: Why do we assume extraterrestrials might want to visit us?

#194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because discoveries are useful. If the collective reason for your species' existence is writing birdsong, you're going to want agriculture to ensure people can eat, medicine to prevent them from dying, and electricity to make rad synthetic birdsong dubstep remixes. Tech solves problems, and everyone has problems. Doesn't mean you need to leave the solar system though.

How is this hypothetical species going to discover any medicine if they spend all their time writing birdsongs? Any individual with a slightly lower proclivity to write birdsongs will be evicted from the gene pool with great prejudice, so there is no chance that anyone will ever be born with the desire to spend a whole hour thinking about something else. Again, if this seems unrealistic, just imagine humanity with th…

Because at some point you run out of food, and if you write birdsong in spite of that you just die out. It may be possible but its not much an effective long term strategy. Too stupid to survive doesn't earn a lot of marks towards being an intelligent species.

Individuals with a desire to improve their survivability being evicted from the gene pool is the opposite of how natural selection works. Humans would still invent things even if painting gave everyone erotic pleasure.

Re: Why do we assume extraterrestrials might want to visit us?

#195

There are also aspects that should be considered in my opinion 1°/ individual intelligence and technological innovation is not necessary an ultimate achivement that enables competitive advantage : human beings may be individually smart (compared to some other species) yet the collective intelligence of humanity is rather poor (which translates to the unability to solve collective problems such as sustainable manageme…

> even if some other intelligent species would exist, maybe they would not have the same need to communicate, the same need or will to travel, the same need or will to innovate, etc. This is true. But even if just a small fraction of civilizations engaged in interstellar expansion, they'd quickly subsume the galaxy on geological timescales. Darwin applies just as much across the stars as it does in a tide pool. As lo…

> and used its dominant position to benevolently stop the game.

Why benevolently? Why not maliciously?

Re: Why do we assume extraterrestrials might want to visit us?

#196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair to rocks, we also study them ...

Is astrogeology (as etymologically oxymoronic as that is) already a subject?

Maybe aliens will be interested in Earth for Astrogastronomy.

Re: Why do we assume extraterrestrials might want to visit us?

#198
post #145

> Fermi’s paradox is pretentious in that it assumes we humans have some sort of cosmic significance. Our significance as a species is actually irrelevant to the question of why we might or might not be visited. Even if we turn out to be somehow extraordinary, the aliens would have to visit first before they could know that.

Imagine aliens of the future for whom the Fermi paradox does not arise, because the galaxy is teeming with what used to be human.

Re: Why do we assume extraterrestrials might want to visit us?

#200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is this hypothetical species going to discover any medicine if they spend all their time writing birdsongs? Any individual with a slightly lower proclivity to write birdsongs will be evicted from the gene pool with great prejudice, so there is no chance that anyone will ever be born with the desire to spend a whole hour thinking about something else. Again, if this seems unrealistic, just imagine humanity with th…

Because at some point you run out of food, and if you write birdsong in spite of that you just die out. It may be possible but its not much an effective long term strategy. Too stupid to survive doesn't earn a lot of marks towards being an intelligent species. Individuals with a desire to improve their survivability being evicted from the gene pool is the opposite of how natural selection works. Humans would still in…

I am suggesting that intelligent populations may often die out. Evolution doesn't look ahead to avoid dead ends.
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