Anthony Levandowski Pardoned • Hacker News Board

Re: Anthony Levandowski Pardoned

#881

Post by kazinator » Wed, Jan 20, 2021, 9:09 PM UTC

slg wrote: post #874

kazinator wrote: post #576

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The origins are totally friggin' relevant. Firstly, the OK gesture is a deeply entrenched, familiar, everyday gesture—at least in North American culture. Only a complete moron could think that it suddenly has to do with white supremacy, and accept it for such use to the point of believing that it is a white supremacist symbol and not the OK gesture any more, so that anyone using it is a racist. Secondly, anyone who h…

Ok, let's try an example in which this issue is further heightened. Would you be comfortable displaying a swastika in the western world today? That symbol didn't originate with the Nazis. Most people simply don't care about the origin. Also I am not saying every use is racist or anything that extreme, but it is clear that in some instances there is a connection between this symbol and white supremacy.

That symbol is associated with mass murder of millions and a world war.

Previous to that, it was not a common, everyday symbol used in western culture.

It's not a dumb little joke from 2017 from 4chan.

The Nazis had a hand gesture: the raised arm Roman salute. You can use that salute today without being dubbed a supremacist or Nazi. Just maybe don't shout heil anything while doing it.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Pardoned

#882

Post by Isinlor » Wed, Jan 20, 2021, 9:10 PM UTC

ardy42 wrote: post #562

emn13 wrote: post #433

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This myth that the US constitution is in any way "good" is weird. It's one of the earliest; and fortunately others leared from its mistakes. Including the US itself, when it had considerable influence in drafting the WW2 losers constitutions, which uncoincidentally are quite different from the US. Checks and balances essentially don't work in the US. The best bit is simply a decent judiciary, but that was mostly copi…

> Checks and balances essentially don't work in the US. The best bit is simply a decent judiciary, but that was mostly copied from the British. And even that is more poorly executed than elsewhere, due to the political nature of judicial appointees, and esp. due to the tradition of direct elections of some judges. I'd say it's arguably worse than the British model it was copied from, not because the Brits were psychi…

Polish constitution has plenty of checks and balances. For example we had fairly well functioning constitutional tribunal. The difference is political culture. Especially the judicial branch of USA withstood the attack from Trump beautifully, but they were no more or less protected than Polish courts are. Polish culture is compromised by the communist mindset.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Pardoned

#883

Post by chipsa » Wed, Jan 20, 2021, 9:11 PM UTC

Jabbles wrote: post #334

WalterBright wrote: post #111

It's important to note the reason the President has the power to pardon anyone for any reason is it's one of the checks and balances, the Constitution is full of them. It's meant as a check to blunt overzealous prosecutions. Note that the President does not have the corresponding power to convict anyone. An interesting set of pardons was when Andrew Johnson pardoned all the rebels in the Confederacy, including Jeffer…

> It's meant as a check to blunt overzealous prosecutions. But aren't prosecutions done by the DoJ, as part of the executive branch, i.e. the decision to prosecute someone at all, or whether to offer a plea deal is already under the president's control?

There's at least 3 steps of bureaucracy between the president and the prosecution: Junior prosecutors->US Attorney->Attorney General->President.

He may ultimately be in charge of the prosecutions, but for him to take that much control is considered unseemly. The closest the President will generally come to deciding whether to prosecute someone is to make a policy that certain crimes will get extra attention or no attention. Alternatively, he can fire the US Attorney.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Pardoned

#884

Post by sleepybrett » Wed, Jan 20, 2021, 9:12 PM UTC

apozem wrote: post #573

NelsonMinar wrote: post #519

It's weird to see the Republican party embrace intellectual property theft. Levandowski stole from his employer and his colleagues at Google to enrich himself at Uber. Why would that possibly be worth a pardon?

Adam Serwer, an excellent writer, explained it: [1] > Law and order, for this president, simply means that he and his ideological allies are above the law, while others, such as [George] Floyd, are merely subject to it. Lewandowski's pardon request was endorsed by Peter Thiel, a huge Trump backer, so he gets to be above the law. Simple. [1]: https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/06/chauvin-di...

I saw reporting that Thiel (and Palmer Luckey) also received a pardon. Anyone have a link to that, I'd like to see specifically what he was pardoned for...

Re: Anthony Levandowski Pardoned

#885

Post by jmull » Wed, Jan 20, 2021, 9:15 PM UTC

jimbokun wrote: post #310

jmull wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Not to "both sides" What do you think you just did?

> Not to "both sides" this too much So not "both siding" too little or too much, but both siding a just right amount?

No “both siding” is the right amount.

The “sides” we ought to be considering are corrupt politicians and those of us who object to corrupt politicians.

Framing this as if there are two equivalent and corrupt sides effectively normalizes and excuses these corrupt pardons.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Pardoned

#886

Post by nojvek » Wed, Jan 20, 2021, 9:16 PM UTC

At this point presidential pardons are being handed out almost everyday. It seems Trump wanted some cash and he sold pardons to the highest bidder.

I mean it’s a good way to make money and influence. Also shows that US is corrupt to the top seat.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Pardoned

#887

Post by jonny_eh » Wed, Jan 20, 2021, 9:21 PM UTC

throw7 wrote: post #829

rjsw wrote: post #569

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought the price was $2M.

john kiriakou said he was seen by trump on tucker carlson and requested jared look into him. jared reached out and part of his pardon "application" was 1/4 of the single page dedicated to how being pardoned would help get trump reelected.

After the election?

Re: Anthony Levandowski Pardoned

#888

Post by mcguire » Wed, Jan 20, 2021, 9:25 PM UTC

IIAOPSW wrote: post #863

mcguire wrote: post #834

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" And even that is more poorly executed than elsewhere, due to the political nature of judicial appointees, and esp. due to the tradition of direct elections of some judges. " How do you pick judges if you don't appoint them or elect them?

Sortition

From what pool?

In Texas, Justices of the Peace have no particular requirements, and are (IIRC) the equivalent of small-claims courts in the rural counties, but have had some special powers, like acting as coroner in counties without access to one. I had a government teacher with a long list of amusing anecdotes---like the JP that determined that a body with like, 27 bullet wounds had committed suicide. Judge Roy Bean was a JP; at one point someone brought in a dead cowboy who had fallen down a cliff. The body was carrying $25 and a pistol. Bean found the cowboy to be carrying a concealed weapon, confiscated the pistol, and fined the body $25.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Pardoned

#889

Post by roenxi » Wed, Jan 20, 2021, 9:25 PM UTC

WickyNilliams wrote: post #219

roenxi wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having researched the issue carefully [0] I would suggest there is an alternative symbolic interpretation. One that goes something like "our opponents believe anything they read on the internet". Even if it is used extensively as a political symbol, it doesn't represent white power. It represents a political sub-group disrespecting their opposition for being gullible. Insofar as it even could represent white power -…

My take is that Poe's Law is bidirectional. You can't tell irony from extremism, nor extremism from irony. It might have started as an ironic joke, but if it gets adopted earnestly by actual white supremacists (see the Christchurch shooter using it in court), then in some contexts it can be interpreted as a genuine symbol of white supremacy.

Mr Christchurch Shooter doesn't have that much power. If he wrapped himself in a rainbow flag, it doesn't mean people should stop using rainbow flags. Ditto him using a thumbs up gesture or an OK handsign. His use or disuse of symbol sin his crime is distasteful, but unimportant.

If he thought he could get people to stop using Islamic symbols by displaying them, he would have been festooned with them.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Pardoned

#890

Post by zarkov99 » Wed, Jan 20, 2021, 9:26 PM UTC

buzzert wrote: post #793

zarkov99 wrote: post #708

Does anyone have some honest insight on why?

Playing devil's advocate here; if you take many steps back and try to look at what's best for the country, you might want to look at citizens with great potential who are currently under lock and key. I don't think anyone is saying Levandowski is innocent (I saw somewhere else in the comments that a pardon is by definition an admission of guilt), but if he's as brilliant of an engineer as some people make him out to…

I can see the abstract logic in there, but it is a really hard to believe that could be Trump's reasoning.