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The first blue pigment discovered in 200 years is now commercially available

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Re: The first blue pigment discovered in 200 years is now commercially available

#71

Post by ehnto »

awalton wrote: post #53
JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #15

Is this ok? >Yttrium is mostly dangerous in the working environment, due to the fact that damps and gasses can be inhaled with air. This can cause lung embolisms, especially during long-term exposure. Yttrium can also cause cancer with humans, as it enlarges the chances of lung cancer when it is inhaled. >Indium compounds are encountered rarely by most people. All indium compounds should be regarded as highly toxic.…

Its oral LD50 was tested to be more than 5000mg/kg according to Shepherd Color Company's MSDS for Blue 10G513 (as it is known commercially). That's well into "non-toxic" as categorized by the EPA. For perspective, that's more than ten times less toxic than caffeine. So, probably pretty safe when used appropriately. I wouldn't go inhaling it, since any fine powder's not great for the lungs, but that shouldn't be news…

I think that's for the processed pigment though, what about during manufacturing?

Re: The first blue pigment discovered in 200 years is now commercially available

#72

Post by corndoge »

awalton wrote: post #53
JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #15

Is this ok? >Yttrium is mostly dangerous in the working environment, due to the fact that damps and gasses can be inhaled with air. This can cause lung embolisms, especially during long-term exposure. Yttrium can also cause cancer with humans, as it enlarges the chances of lung cancer when it is inhaled. >Indium compounds are encountered rarely by most people. All indium compounds should be regarded as highly toxic.…

Its oral LD50 was tested to be more than 5000mg/kg according to Shepherd Color Company's MSDS for Blue 10G513 (as it is known commercially). That's well into "non-toxic" as categorized by the EPA. For perspective, that's more than ten times less toxic than caffeine. So, probably pretty safe when used appropriately. I wouldn't go inhaling it, since any fine powder's not great for the lungs, but that shouldn't be news…

Isn't LD50 only relevant to acute exposure?[0] Just because you can eat 5 grams of something and survive doesn't mean repeated exposure to it in smaller quantities or in other ways won't hurt you (obviously). E.g. acute inhalation of asbestos has no recorded mortality. I think I'm missing something in your post.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median_lethal_dose

Re: The first blue pigment discovered in 200 years is now commercially available

#73

Post by trevortheblack »

> The store sells the paint for $179.40 for just 40 ML. By comparison, the other structure acrylics it offers starting in sizes no smaller than 75 ML are available from just $8.70.

$4.485 per ML versus $0.116 per ML. That's a difference of almost 40x cost. I wonder how much of that is offset by how saturated/opaque the pigment is. Still, an incredibly expensive blue.

> Connecticut artist Michael Rothman got his hands on some Kremer YInMn blue pigment in 2019 and produced his own paint, “hand milling the dry material in acrylic emulsion resin,” he said.

I wonder what the difference in cost is for the dry pigment

Re: The first blue pigment discovered in 200 years is now commercially available

#74

Post by scns »

ashtonkem wrote: post #34
JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #15

Is this ok? >Yttrium is mostly dangerous in the working environment, due to the fact that damps and gasses can be inhaled with air. This can cause lung embolisms, especially during long-term exposure. Yttrium can also cause cancer with humans, as it enlarges the chances of lung cancer when it is inhaled. >Indium compounds are encountered rarely by most people. All indium compounds should be regarded as highly toxic.…

A surprising number of dyes and pigments are very toxic. I have no idea if this is unusually toxic, but it wouldn’t surprise me if it’s the norm.

There are carcinogenic ones used in red lipstick.

Re: The first blue pigment discovered in 200 years is now commercially available

#75

Post by perl4ever »

TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #49
cromka wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just google "mercury amalgam cancer".

I live in pride of my mercury-compound amalgam. You can choose to live in fear. "Numerous other organizations have also publicly declared the safety and effectiveness of amalgam. These include the Mayo clinic,[21] the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA),[22] Health Canada,[23] Alzheimer's Association,[24] American Academy of Pediatrics,[25] Autism Society of America,[26] U.S. Environmental Protection Agency,[27]…

For better or worse, the dentists I have gone to in recent years don't use it any more. I have some old mercury fillings and at least one newer resin one.

Your link is interesting. It seems like the arguments against mercury amalgam being a problem include:

1) organizations like you listed saying don't worry

2) obvious scammers making a living blaming everything on fillings, even nonexistent ones

3) only 5% of people with fillings having elevated mercury in urine, particularly gum chewers

4) "hypersensitivity or allergy" are the "most likely health effects" but there is not clear evidence for or against autoimmune disorders caused by fillings.

It seems to me that it's perfectly conceivable, at the same time, that there is or has been a scam/cult of mercury fillings causing every possible problem, and at the same time, that they do do something to a minority of recipients that is different from acute mercury toxicity that we know about. There could be a combination of more than normal mercury released and more than normal sensitivity.

Something that would be interesting to research, I think, is the microbiome of people with and without different kinds of fillings. There's been some recent claim(s) about the bacteria that cause gingivitis being linked to Alzheimers.

Re: The first blue pigment discovered in 200 years is now commercially available

#76

Post by xapata »

OpieCunningham wrote: post #55
TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in pride of my mercury-compound amalgam. You can choose to live in fear. "Numerous other organizations have also publicly declared the safety and effectiveness of amalgam. These include the Mayo clinic,[21] the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA),[22] Health Canada,[23] Alzheimer's Association,[24] American Academy of Pediatrics,[25] Autism Society of America,[26] U.S. Environmental Protection Agency,[27]…

From that link: “A large retrospective cohort study found a significant association of mercury based fillings with the development of Parkinson's disease.” (Reference to 2000 - 2008 study in Taiwan.)

How many diseases did they significance test? What's the causal mechanism? Was there a proportional response, or was the causal variable thresholded arbitrarily?

Re: The first blue pigment discovered in 200 years is now commercially available

#77

Post by onei »

JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #28
tryptophan wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chemical reactions (such as forming it into a pigment) greatly change the biological effects substances have. For example, you probably shouldn't drink OH- or H2O2, even though it is made of the same atoms as water. Just because the pure elemental form is toxic doesn't make compounds with it toxic as well.

I don't think that is a very good example. A better example would be is there a safe compound with lead or arsenic or mercury (known toxic elements) you would want to take into your body?

Thimerosal is a mercury compound used as a preservative in vaccinations [1].

1. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thiomersal

Re: The first blue pigment discovered in 200 years is now commercially available

#79

Post by tekkk »

These people really didnt think about how people are going to pronounce their pigment? YInMn - what a monster of a name. In the olden days at least people gave colors great names that were easy to prounounce and provided them personality. Ultramarine, prussian blue.. Even vantablack has a nice rhythm.

It's nice as techinical name, I guess, but I'd hope they have some better brand name they are going by.

Re: The first blue pigment discovered in 200 years is now commercially available

#80

Post by Scea91 »

ampdepolymerase wrote: post #42
JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that is a very good example. A better example would be is there a safe compound with lead or arsenic or mercury (known toxic elements) you would want to take into your body?

Organic chemistry should probably be made mandatory as part of high school science education like physics. Parent looks like Exhibit A for anti-thiomersal hysteria.

It is not? I had at least 2 years of organic chemistry at high school (Czechia).
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