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Y Combinator’s Paul Graham: We’re Looking For People Like Us

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Re: Y Combinator’s Paul Graham: We’re Looking For People Like Us

#31

Post by blacksmythe »

lurker19 wrote: post #17
patio11 wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's amazing how much you can do when you start unbreaking things. Edit: That was excessively brief. So many parts about the whole investment cycle were broken. Some are marginally less broken now. Having a negotiation between a fresh engineering graduate who does not know what "pre-money valuation" means and the principal of a firm with 9 figures under management, and expecting that negotiation to produce an equitab…

This is a good point, but to your original point: "invest in me just because I impressed PG (plus more good reasons that may be true but the investor cannot see)" does not fall into your category of "unbreaking things" like the rest, especially at the start of YC. By now YC has certainly built institutional credibility, but even that can be broken if one day PG turns evil and sells out the brand like Pyrex or show or…

  >> turns evil and sells out the brand
Doesn't seem like in his best interest. His present model has been incredibly successful, and what he is selling is a pre-screened class.

I imagine that his applicant pool is becoming more and more qualified over time, giving him a graduating 'class' that is constantly improving.

Re: Y Combinator’s Paul Graham: We’re Looking For People Like Us

#32

Post by citizenkeys »

Meh... Y Combinator is a potential source of start-up funding. Just as important, Y Combinator is not exclusive of any other source of funding. The difference between YC and other sources of funding is that YC funds a lot of companies twice a year rather than on an as-needed basis so the whole process is very eventful.

As YC funds more companies, the value of the "We're a YC company" branding diminishes faster. Whatsmore, there's some curious economics in how YC companies do business with other YC companies. If the bulk of customers of YC companies are other YC companies, then you what you have is basically just a pyramid scheme. It's also kinda lame to hear Paul Graham play favorites and talk about how great Sam Altman is all the time.

Re: Y Combinator’s Paul Graham: We’re Looking For People Like Us

#33

Post by Duff »

freshfunk wrote: post #21
kemiller wrote: post #14

This is probably the single most discouraging thing I've ever read about startups, but at least it's honest. Entitlement? "Naughtiness"? I think after Google, the idea got out there that it's possible to succeed by just being good . Technically and morally. This sounds like a return to status quo. Not saying he's wrong. He's almost certainly right, it's just depressing.

I understand the positive qualities of being Kirk-esque and creating one's own rules (see Kobayashi Maru). I also understand the qualities of being single-minded in purpose, determination and the will to succeed. These are qualities needed to survive in the uncertain, risky and scary environment of an entrepreneur. However, I wonder when we begin to cross the fine-line between naughtiness, white-lies, small-rule brea…

I think that you're zooming into this too much and missing the point.

Think about the difference between success in the military versus success in a small business. In the Army, a protocol faux pas or a single ill-considered statement can implode your career path. Understanding of and adherence to the rules is job 1.

In a startup mode, you can ignore conventions/rules, because those things are often not relevant to a tiny company. That doesn't mean that you have carte blanche to rob a liquor store -- but it does mean that you don't need approval from a VP to fill out a 4 page expense report to buy a bottle of booze for a client.

Re: Y Combinator’s Paul Graham: We’re Looking For People Like Us

#34

Post by freshfunk »

gruseom wrote: post #29
freshfunk wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a morally-flexible environment, it's easy to confuse the two. For example - Zynga selling offers (for credits) with very fine print that signs you up for paid services. And the fine print is so convoluted/tiny most people don't read it. Helping or hurting consumers? - Facebook hiring a PR firm to highlight questionable privacy practices by Google. Helping users or hurting Google? - Subprime mortgages. Helping or h…

In a morally-flexible environment You're assuming your conclusion. Punctiliously following convention doesn't make you good. It just safely ensconces you near the mean. Not a promising place for startup founders to reside. Calvin from Calvin and Hobbes is naughty. He's not evil or even "morally-flexible".

Perhaps you should look to real business rather than comics for examples. It would be more convincing.

Re: Y Combinator’s Paul Graham: We’re Looking For People Like Us

#35

Post by rubashov »

metra wrote: post #30
rubashov wrote: post #26

Is the sandals with socks thing some sort of deliberate middle-finger? In NYC on a stage, no less.

Birkenstocks with socks is okay: http://www.gq.com/style/style-guy/shoes/200309/birkenstocks

Birkenstocks are never OK.

Re: Y Combinator’s Paul Graham: We’re Looking For People Like Us

#37

Post by jdp23 »

freshfunk wrote: post #24
gruseom wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're confusing naughtiness with evil. Naughtiness has to do with breaking conventions, evil with hurting others. If you followed PG's record, you'd know how strong an advocate he is that startups be good.

In a morally-flexible environment, it's easy to confuse the two. For example - Zynga selling offers (for credits) with very fine print that signs you up for paid services. And the fine print is so convoluted/tiny most people don't read it. Helping or hurting consumers? - Facebook hiring a PR firm to highlight questionable privacy practices by Google. Helping users or hurting Google? - Subprime mortgages. Helping or h…

Dropbox lying about their security guarantees ....

Re: Y Combinator’s Paul Graham: We’re Looking For People Like Us

#38

Post by smokeyj »

freshfunk wrote: post #21
kemiller wrote: post #14

This is probably the single most discouraging thing I've ever read about startups, but at least it's honest. Entitlement? "Naughtiness"? I think after Google, the idea got out there that it's possible to succeed by just being good . Technically and morally. This sounds like a return to status quo. Not saying he's wrong. He's almost certainly right, it's just depressing.

I understand the positive qualities of being Kirk-esque and creating one's own rules (see Kobayashi Maru). I also understand the qualities of being single-minded in purpose, determination and the will to succeed. These are qualities needed to survive in the uncertain, risky and scary environment of an entrepreneur. However, I wonder when we begin to cross the fine-line between naughtiness, white-lies, small-rule brea…

I feel 'naughtiness' represents disregard for the status quo, rather than a commitment to immorality. The obedient drone regards law-breaking as immoral, whereas the independent thinker would ask why the law exists.

Re: Y Combinator’s Paul Graham: We’re Looking For People Like Us

#39

Post by freshfunk »

Duff wrote: post #33
freshfunk wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand the positive qualities of being Kirk-esque and creating one's own rules (see Kobayashi Maru). I also understand the qualities of being single-minded in purpose, determination and the will to succeed. These are qualities needed to survive in the uncertain, risky and scary environment of an entrepreneur. However, I wonder when we begin to cross the fine-line between naughtiness, white-lies, small-rule brea…

I think that you're zooming into this too much and missing the point. Think about the difference between success in the military versus success in a small business. In the Army, a protocol faux pas or a single ill-considered statement can implode your career path. Understanding of and adherence to the rules is job 1. In a startup mode, you can ignore conventions/rules, because those things are often not relevant to a…

Actually I think you misunderstand and misinterpret my point. I'll try to clarify.

I think much of what's excepted in today's business environment can be summarized by the following statement:

"It's easier to ask for forgiveness than it is to get permission."

This logic has been used to justify all sorts of questionable actions. It's what Pincus was speaking to when he said, "we broke every rule in the book" or when Facebook unilaterally changes a once private profile to a public one. Heck, I'd even characterize Google's Buzz in this category.

Businesses do this all the time. I don't necessarily blame them. Most times it's easier and quicker to simply execute on an idea and see if there's any backlash. Much of innovation comes about this way so I do see the value in it.

But I also see the negative consequences of it.

Re: Y Combinator’s Paul Graham: We’re Looking For People Like Us

#40

Post by jdp23 »

citizenkeys wrote: post #32

Meh... Y Combinator is a potential source of start-up funding. Just as important, Y Combinator is not exclusive of any other source of funding. The difference between YC and other sources of funding is that YC funds a lot of companies twice a year rather than on an as-needed basis so the whole process is very eventful. As YC funds more companies, the value of the "We're a YC company" branding diminishes faster. Whats…

Very good point about the economics of YC companies doing business with each other, and I would extend that to their investors' circles as well. It's worked so far ...
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