The corporations, rich and powerful want (at least the illusion) of full control over the communication channels so they can prevent honest people from organizing en masse and rising up. What is happening here in Madrid is a first for this country: http://www.tvspain.tv/blog/?p=3026
I don't know what you're smoking if you think "the corporations" have even 0.1% of the power of your own democratically elected government. Who has all the guns in your country? I bet it's not the phone company...
G8 agenda calls for "civilized Internet": monitored, governed, controlled, taxed
41–50 of 108 posts
Re: G8 agenda calls for "civilized Internet": monitored, governed, controlled, taxed
#42This in accord with the emerging counterforce of various anonymous networking projects that are reaching the state of being usable. These networks are likely to evolve to the point where, instead of using proxies and non-standard protocols, the users actually access a regular IPv6 subnet that simply uses the onion-routed private network such as Phantom or I2P as the carrier. I say IPv6 because nearly all operating sy…
I agree that even the Great Firewall of China can easily be beaten by simply using Tor, however, it is now our democratic duty to prevent this from becoming a necessity in the western world.
Re: G8 agenda calls for "civilized Internet": monitored, governed, controlled, taxed
#43This is a clear case where we see the idea that governments should represent the will of their citizens break down completely. Every power structure serves its own needs first. In areas where the interest of governmental systems and the citizens are in alignment, democracy can work - but when there is a conflict between the will of a power structure to extend its power and influence and the desires of the citizens, g…
While I agree with most of what you say, I'm not so sure " large majorities in favour of free communication over the internet " Do you have any data to back this up? My guess is that if you frame it the right way, most people would vote for censoring the Internet
There has been a study showing that a large majority of Chinese are actually in favor of their internet control, over 90%. That's 1 billion people right there.
Studies in muslim countries consistently show that there, too, large majorities want internet to be non-free (and in many countries it is). Again that's close to 1 billion people.
And, again India supports it too. Assuming most Indian people agree with India's constitution that gives you a majority of "world citizens" without needing a single American or European vote.
The sad fact is that it is obvious : a world government would be an a lot more repressive than the American government, a fact that can not seriously come as a surprise to anyone who watches UN decisions (e.g. the UN human rights council, consisting of China, Saudi arabia, Libya, ...), who derise Israel's rough treatment of 2 women at a border crossing, WHILE they are themselves comitting genocide on their own people.
And, frankly, even most Europeans are in favor of outlawing "hate speech" (which basically means outlawing what are considered undesirable political movements. The problem is of course that 20%-30% (at least) of European citizens are members of these parties).
I've lived in Europe for a long time, and the effects of this go from mildly-scary (such as the de-facto outlawing of research that might alter our ideas about global warming, including the study ways to fix it through "artificial" means, like artificially increasing or decreasing cloud cover (Euro governments really don't like the fact that global warming could be fixed with 5 planes, or a decent fleet of automated ships, spreading reflective particles in the athmosphere). There's also downright scary ways liberties are curtailed in Europe, such as EUCD enforcement, which is way worse than the DMCA ever will be (but even the EUCD is child's play compared to muslim, African, chinese, or Indian internet laws).
America is the only country I've ever been where you can generally assume that someone you start talking to in the street is in favor of a completely free press, a completely free internet. The only one.
But America is less than 5% of the world population.
This is why you want internet control to remain in the US government's hands, against the "will of the people". All these countries, with the agreement of their citizens, would make the internet a tiny echo chamber that simply shows them how they were right all along.
There's the hope that since Texas wants the internet to prove the earth is only 5000 year old, and Saudi Arabia want people beheaded that suggest evolution happened, or that show their own genocidal history (or is it the other way around ?), this will somehow "balance out". Frankly, I doubt it.
The result will be quite the reverse, only non-offensive subjects will be allowed on the internet. Nothing even mildly suggestive. No history study at all, because most everyone objects to their own history (e.g. the American treatment of black slaves pales in comparison to the muslim treatment of black slaves. Then again, the holocaust pales in comparison to muslim treatment of black slaves). Things like GDP, that could be taken to "prove" that most countries (all except America and China) are worse than others, will be outlawed ... and so on and so forth.
In general "truth" would be outlawed. Because facts hurt too many people's feelings.
Re: G8 agenda calls for "civilized Internet": monitored, governed, controlled, taxed
#44Re: G8 agenda calls for "civilized Internet": monitored, governed, controlled, taxed
#45Of course, some jackhole will tell me that I must be horribly uninformed if my knee doesn't jerk like theirs. I don't think any answer to that will suffice for someone who feels that way (Q:"How can you not be driven into a frothing rage about the 'kill switch bill'?" A:"I actually read it.") but at least consider that I was actively seeking information when I clicked on the link and was disappointed to find instead a glittering call to action based on interpretations I don't share, punching at emotional triggers that I don't have.
Re: G8 agenda calls for "civilized Internet": monitored, governed, controlled, taxed
#46Earlier quoted context omitted.
That is not an argument, that is a propaganda tool used against the easily-persuaded.
The easily-persuaded pretty much describes the majority of the electorate, at least in my country. The average American votes against his best interest. The official response to any opposition to totalitarian tactics is .. FUD. Something only less blatant than what I have written above.
Compared to what you find in every middle eastern countries, the US government hardly ever touches the internet. Compared to most Asian countries (not just China), same.
Opposition to totalitarianism in the US ... well, at least it exists and actually created a non-totalitarian government.
More than 50% of all humans alive DO live under totalitarian governments, where it's not just a theoretical possibility to get executed for a blog post. A person sharing your name, mahmud, got arrested in Bahrain for suggesting that executing gays is (and he included maybe) not the best idea. Sadly, Bahrain is easily the most free middle eastern country. I dare you, just try living in the middle east for 6 months. Just try it. Anywhere.
Re: G8 agenda calls for "civilized Internet": monitored, governed, controlled, taxed
#47This in accord with the emerging counterforce of various anonymous networking projects that are reaching the state of being usable. These networks are likely to evolve to the point where, instead of using proxies and non-standard protocols, the users actually access a regular IPv6 subnet that simply uses the onion-routed private network such as Phantom or I2P as the carrier. I say IPv6 because nearly all operating sy…
I agree that even the Great Firewall of China can easily be beaten by simply using Tor, however, it is now our democratic duty to prevent this from becoming a necessity in the western world.
The state firewalls of China, Saudi Arabia and the like are blocking all Tor nodes (those are public). Even skilled hackers are unable to bypass the filtering, unless they have friends abroad or international credit/debit card.
Re: G8 agenda calls for "civilized Internet": monitored, governed, controlled, taxed
#48Every time such thoughts come up, I am reminded of how difficult it is to bring the world to a consensus. Easier said than done, it's pretty comfortable putting a regulation on paper but bringing it to practice can take a toll. Internet regulation does not stop at content policing and stopping malicious activities, it rather extends to creating difficulties in doing online business globally and taking a toll on innov…
Re: G8 agenda calls for "civilized Internet": monitored, governed, controlled, taxed
#49Keep your cowardly, sniveling, risk-averse, myopic, GREEDY fucking agenda OFF OF MY INTERNET! You've already done quite enough, thanks. I was going to come up with a more level-headed and well reasoned response here, but I guess the first bit really sums it up. There are days where I wonder if Academia didn't have the right idea with Internet 2.0. Whatever happened with that anyway?
Agreed. The truth is that us nerds won't like governments taking over the 'Net, but they're far more representative of its user base than we are. We're pretty dependent on the results of this 'civilizing' process in most every other aspect of life, why's it so surprising when it's applied here?
- - Frank Herbert, Dune series
Re: G8 agenda calls for "civilized Internet": monitored, governed, controlled, taxed
#50This is a clear case where we see the idea that governments should represent the will of their citizens break down completely. Every power structure serves its own needs first. In areas where the interest of governmental systems and the citizens are in alignment, democracy can work - but when there is a conflict between the will of a power structure to extend its power and influence and the desires of the citizens, g…
While I agree with most of what you say, I'm not so sure " large majorities in favour of free communication over the internet " Do you have any data to back this up? My guess is that if you frame it the right way, most people would vote for censoring the Internet