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Poll: Switching from WhatsApp

news.ycombinator.com

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Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp

#961

Post by mschuetz »

dvdgsng wrote: post #957
mschuetz wrote: post #917

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PCs, using the web version. One is "Verify your login" with no option to verify, only skip. The next one is "Are you sure you want to skip?", which is insulting/ironic because skipping is the only option. The third one is "Help us improve Element", which doesn't accept a no and keeps asking again and again. And just now I closed element and trying to open it again results in a white page.

> One is "Verify your login" with no option to verify, only skip. The idea is to verify the new login on ANOTHER session, if available. This is required for reading encrypted messages. When you see this message a notification will show up on all of your other Element devices asking you to verify that new session (using a QR code or a bunch of emojis). You can also select "This wasn't me - your account may be compromi…

This is all I get: https://ibb.co/N62J5cK "Skip" is the only thing I can really do here.

> When you see this message a notification will show up on all of your other Element devices asking you to verify that new session

I have two element devices, both PCs at different locations. And both using the web version of Element. Am I supposed to verify the other device while logged in at both PCs at different locations?

EDIT: And this is the "help us improve element" message that always pops up, no matter how many times I decline: https://ibb.co/WKkDHDd

Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp

#962

Post by pdimitar »

hypersundays wrote: post #893
pdimitar wrote: post #486

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah. It rode on the "free SMS" wave for way too long and people still use it because of that... nevermind that SMS-es are free in most of the world nowadays. :D Or the fact that literally every messenger is free and most have no ads (unlike Viber which does have ads). The very continued existence of Viber is a living testament of the glacial pace with which the non-tech folk pick up on what's wrong with some of the…

I actually think the existence of Viber is a testament to how much Western tech does not pay attention to parts of the world like Asia. I genuinely hate the UX of Viber but since moving back to the Philippines, I've been involved in this long lesson on how much tech orgs (at least in the US) don't pay attention to these parts of the world. It seems to me that lack of care and attention leads to the rise and dominance…

I like how practical a lot of Asians are. This gave rise to WeChat where you can literally do almost anything you can think of -- calling for transport and paying people included.

This made it really easy for the Chinese gov to track people but in the end people value convenience more than potential surveillance state repercussions.

We as a programmers must learn to respect that and think in terms of what's convenient for our users -- and not what's a trendy tech or some such.

Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp

#963

Post by chessmango »

rglullis wrote: post #228

From the listed alternatives, only Matrix is the one that actually solves the issue of not having to trust our communications to any single monopolistic entity. You could add XMPP there as well, but it really doesn't matter. What does matter is for us to start pushing for openness and start evangelizing/helping others to adopt anything that puts us back in control of our communication. This is the one thing to fix, a…

Just wanted to point out that your cert for storage.communick.com has expired. I'm assuming yours (or at least related) because mentioned with a cough :P

Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp

#964

Post by ffpip »

ryanlol wrote: post #951
ffpip wrote: post #641

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Link.

https://m.habr.com/ru/post/206900/ FiloSottile described it as “The most backdoor-looking bug I’ve ever seen” https://twitter.com/filosottile/status/987376021589692416?s=...

That was the month telegram launched? It's been 7 years. It was a new app. The same bug is still being used against it?

Do you have any recent bugs? Or 'backdoors'? All their official apps are open source and reproducible. Must be easy to find bugs for security researchers. They even offer much larger bounties compared to other apps.

Anything? I want to believe people saying bad crypto, but it looks like there's no actual proof.

Here's something that says it is good, published more recently.

https://web.archive.org/web/20180727070936/https://www.susan...

https://kryptera.se/assets/uploads/2015/12/Telegram-cryptana...

Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp

#965

Post by ebrenes »

selestify wrote: post #901
randomsearch wrote: post #361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it’s simpler. Boycotts don’t work at an individual level. I have been boycotting nestle for decades. Can’t say they’ve become less evil. That’s because the marginal effect is negligible for them and strongly negative for the individual (assuming you’re a fan of Kit Kat’s). Network effects amplify the marginal impact on the individual, because they lead to a monopoly with no true competition. Sure, you can lea…

What do you think the differences between modern boycotts and Rosa Parks bus boycott are? Why are modern ones so ineffective in comparison?

Another factor is that the black people that were mainly affected by the segregation were the primary funders of the bus system. Their boycott was incredibly significant to the bottom line.

Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp

#966

Post by chinathrow »

j780 wrote: post #959
chinathrow wrote: post #820

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, the nerds have not failed us. The founders of WhatsApp has failed us by selling for FU money. I was happy paying them a fee in the beginning. Then authorities have failed us by aproving the merger.

Maybe they didn't fail us... Wikipedia: On February 21, 2018, Moxie Marlinspike and WhatsApp co-founder Brian Acton announced the formation of the Signal Foundation

They failed us to sell WhatsApp to FB while the networks effects are (at least in Europe) in full effect. I simply can't abandon WhatsApp due to this now.

Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp

#967

Post by ryanlol »

ffpip wrote: post #964
ryanlol wrote: post #951

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://m.habr.com/ru/post/206900/ FiloSottile described it as “The most backdoor-looking bug I’ve ever seen” https://twitter.com/filosottile/status/987376021589692416?s=...

That was the month telegram launched? It's been 7 years. It was a new app. The same bug is still being used against it? Do you have any recent bugs? Or 'backdoors'? All their official apps are open source and reproducible. Must be easy to find bugs for security researchers. They even offer much larger bounties compared to other apps. Anything? I want to believe people saying bad crypto, but it looks like there's no a…

It’s really obvious this wasn’t a bug, but a backdoor. It proves that Telegram is an actively hostile adversary, the fact that their encryption scheme hasn’t been publicly broken since then doesn’t change that.

> Or 'backdoors'?

You might argue that their deliberate decision to not encrypt most chats is exactly that, more of a front door really.

Telegram is a bad actor.

Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp

#969

Post by sevrinsky »

exhilaration wrote: post #404
fahadkhan wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it interesting to that people don't use WhatsApp at all. Many posts here are claiming not using WhatsApp is impossible. Grandparent's experience demonstrate that it is.

It depends on the country you're in and what country your extended family is in. Whatsapp absolutely dominates in South Asia and South America. You can see a full map here: https://www.messengerpeople.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/s... Most Americans, for example, have no need for it. I feel like iMessage is the dominant messaging platform in the U.S.

That's an unbelievably poorly colored map -- 3 subtly different shades of green, 3 subtly different shades of blue. It's almost as though a colorblind designer set out to make everyone else suffer.

Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp

#970

Post by sevrinsky »

zajio1am wrote: post #371
timvdalen wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It can be in area's (such as in The Netherlands) where literally _everyone_ is on WhatsApp and it is the default form of personal online communication. Not using WhatsApp means not being able to communicate with a lot of people.

Do not they have e-mail? That seems like safe default.

To most people, email is something that you use for work, or if you're over 50.
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