Smart contracts on Bitcoin

#1

Post by rmason » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 7:59 PM UTC

Re: Smart contracts on Bitcoin

#2

Post by seibelj » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 8:42 PM UTC

On a first skim it looks like a bespoke blockchain that commits its state to the bitcoin blockchain to ensure finality. Seems kind of neat, but I wouldn't call it "smart contracts on bitcoin".

Re: Smart contracts on Bitcoin

#3

Post by vmception » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 8:44 PM UTC

seibelj wrote: post #2

On a first skim it looks like a bespoke blockchain that commits its state to the bitcoin blockchain to ensure finality. Seems kind of neat, but I wouldn't call it "smart contracts on bitcoin".

I've moved off the ideological train and hopped on the "can the market bear it" train.

The market can bear committing states to the bitcoin blockchain, and there hasn't been a standardized way to do that. I would therefore call it smart contracts on bitcoin.

Re: Smart contracts on Bitcoin

#4

Post by cal5k » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 8:46 PM UTC

seibelj wrote: post #2

On a first skim it looks like a bespoke blockchain that commits its state to the bitcoin blockchain to ensure finality. Seems kind of neat, but I wouldn't call it "smart contracts on bitcoin".

Layer 2 seems to be the logical way forward - network fees have gotten ridiculous on the Bitcoin blockchain, and reducing the frequency with which you need to settle there would be a big win. On top of all the added functionality of smart contracts, of course.

Re: Smart contracts on Bitcoin

#5

Post by Acrobatic_Road » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 8:56 PM UTC

We already have this. It's called WBTC and TBTC. Turns out it's way easier to port Bitcoin to Ethereum than to rebuild Ethereum on Bitcoin.

Re: Smart contracts on Bitcoin

#6

Post by DennisP » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 8:58 PM UTC

Moving bitcoins to Stacks is easy, since Stacks reads the Bitcoin chain. But how do you move them from Stacks back to the Bitcoin main chain? Since Bitcoin clients aren't aware of Stacks, it's difficult to see how that would work without trusting someone to issue the correct transaction.

I looked over the Stacks site and didn't see a clear answer to this question.

Re: Smart contracts on Bitcoin

#7

Post by kylebenzle » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 8:59 PM UTC

cal5k wrote: post #4

seibelj wrote: post #2

On a first skim it looks like a bespoke blockchain that commits its state to the bitcoin blockchain to ensure finality. Seems kind of neat, but I wouldn't call it "smart contracts on bitcoin".

Layer 2 seems to be the logical way forward - network fees have gotten ridiculous on the Bitcoin blockchain, and reducing the frequency with which you need to settle there would be a big win. On top of all the added functionality of smart contracts, of course.

Please, don't forget, Bitcoin Core (BTC) was hijacked years ago by corporate interests and purposefully crippled with high fees.

From day one Bitcoin was designed to have low or no fees, it is only because Blockstream was able to wrestle control of the GitHub repo and stop the block size increase arbitrarily that high fees exists.

Bitcoin Cash (BCH) long ago took over the "Bitcoin" project as designed by Satoshi Nakamoto and described in his White Paper. Bitcoin Core (BTC) is a broken system designed to enrich developers of "Second Layer" solutions like this.

BTC has failed completely as Peer-to-Peer Digital Cash and today is push only by charlatans and scammers.

Re: Smart contracts on Bitcoin

#8

Post by mason55 » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 8:59 PM UTC

Acrobatic_Road wrote: post #5

We already have this. It's called WBTC and TBTC. Turns out it's way easier to port Bitcoin to Ethereum than to rebuild Ethereum on Bitcoin.

> Turns out it's way easier to port Bitcoin to Ethereum than to rebuild Ethereum on Bitcoin.

Technically that might be the case but in the real world you have network effects, inertia, and all kinds of other reason why it might be desirable to go in the other direction.

The ease has to be examined from the perspective of the system as a whole and not just the one component.

Re: Smart contracts on Bitcoin

#9

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 8:59 PM UTC

[deleted]

Re: Smart contracts on Bitcoin

#10

Post by kylebenzle » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 9:02 PM UTC

mason55 wrote: post #8

Acrobatic_Road wrote: post #5

We already have this. It's called WBTC and TBTC. Turns out it's way easier to port Bitcoin to Ethereum than to rebuild Ethereum on Bitcoin.

> Turns out it's way easier to port Bitcoin to Ethereum than to rebuild Ethereum on Bitcoin. Technically that might be the case but in the real world you have network effects, inertia, and all kinds of other reason why it might be desirable to go in the other direction. The ease has to be examined from the perspective of the system as a whole and not just the one component.

The Bitcoin Core (BTC) market is pushed forward only by fraud (Tether) and lies (censorship of BitcoinTalk and r/Bitcoin).

The Bitcoin Core project was hijacked and socially engineered away from the lead developers many years ago by Adam Back's Blockstream. Today it is a Ponzi scheme designed to push people onto their "second layer" solutions to "solve" the problems they themselves introduced.