Facebook Has Been Showing Military Gear Ads Next to “Insurrection” Posts • Hacker News Board

Re: Facebook Has Been Showing Military Gear Ads Next to “Insurrection” Posts

#141

Post by ocdtrekkie » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 5:13 PM UTC

manigandham wrote: post #120

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why the solution is liability: Companies will keep leaving unchecked algorithms responsible for this until they can go to jail for doing so. Adtech is a cancer and it's time to cut it out using every legislative and regulatory option we have. Put Mark Zuckerberg and Sundar Pichai behind bars and the problem will correct after that.

Liability for what exactly? How about people who actually commit bad acts are the ones responsible for it? It seems like you haven't really thought about this and are just personally against adtech and those companies. That's not how rights and legislation should be decided.

Fostering insurrection for profit is, I am pretty sure, illegal. And I'm pretty sure a prison or worse offense.

Re: Facebook Has Been Showing Military Gear Ads Next to “Insurrection” Posts

#142

Post by dqpb » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 5:14 PM UTC

jonathanstrange wrote: post #4

Yes, Facebook is still love-hated by so many because their algorithms are outstanding for finding potential customers. There is no doubt about that, at least for trained conversion campaigns.

True. The title of the article could be 'Facebook Has Been Showing Relevant Ads Next To "Insurrection" Posts'.

Re: Facebook Has Been Showing Military Gear Ads Next to “Insurrection” Posts

#143

Post by arcticbull » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 5:17 PM UTC

JasonFruit wrote: post #139

arcticbull wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the major specific roles of government in a civil society is to maintain and establish the rules of fair play which then allow for a functioning market economy. This represents an inherent compromise.We recognize and appreciate the value that integration and scale provides, and we use the scale of the government to keep it in check. This isn’t just about going out and talking to people who disagree with you. P…

I disagree on your first paragraph, but that's less critical than my disagreement with your second and third. Don't you think that some personal engagement could help bring that parallel universe — and yours — back into sync with reality? You say the algorithms chip away at our ability to have conversations, but I see the opposite: real life has a stronger effect on people's perceptions of truth than on-line bubbles,…

The role of government is literally to establish rules for fair play in a free market economy. Like that’s the point of the United States code :-) that’s what being a rule of law country means.

Regarding the rest I’m not saying don’t talk to them, By all means invite crazy Susie over for dinner. Have those conversations. It’s tilting at windmills as long as they continue to get their reality defined by what they’re going to react to online and in media.

Humans aren’t really able to process an objective reality, we live in a world of abstractions. Our preconceived notions of what the universe and objective reality are define are personal realities. Reality is all around each and everyone of us, if objective reality were all it took, we wouldn’t be having this conversation in the first place.

Re: Facebook Has Been Showing Military Gear Ads Next to “Insurrection” Posts

#144

Post by nataz » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 5:19 PM UTC

SauciestGNU wrote: post #125

nataz wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm seeing adds for illegal pistol and rifle suppressors (aka "silencers") only barely disguised as "fuel filters" and "solvent traps". The companies selling the suppressor kits claim they are legitimate auto parts. They clearly aren't. Some people have claimed that it would be legal to buy these if you applied for a license to manufacture a suppressor, but good luck arguing that in federal court, especially since th…

I'm going to be pedantic, but in the US, those silencer kits can be legal. There are requirements for the provenance of the components used in them (can't be imported) but until you drill out the bore they're solvent traps or fuel filters. And if you pay for a tax stamp and file the correct paperwork with the ATF, it's completely legal to transform those items into a firearm suppressor.

Good luck.

A lot of "if" statements in your comment.

The ones I saw were clearly not manufactured in the USA, and based on the comment sections were clearly understood to be suppressor components.

Lots of YouTube/internet "I'm not a lawyer, but..." comments floating out there.

Even if we were being extraordinary charitable, all plausible deniability goes out the window with even a cursory reading of the the description and the comments for these items.

Re: Facebook Has Been Showing Military Gear Ads Next to “Insurrection” Posts

#145

Post by ytwySXpMbS » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 5:19 PM UTC

manigandham wrote: post #120

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why the solution is liability: Companies will keep leaving unchecked algorithms responsible for this until they can go to jail for doing so. Adtech is a cancer and it's time to cut it out using every legislative and regulatory option we have. Put Mark Zuckerberg and Sundar Pichai behind bars and the problem will correct after that.

Liability for what exactly? How about people who actually commit bad acts are the ones responsible for it? It seems like you haven't really thought about this and are just personally against adtech and those companies. That's not how rights and legislation should be decided.

How is someone supporting and fostering a bad act not also to blame? I see from your profile you work in adtech, perhaps rights shouldn't be decided by people who seek to avoid blame because they profit from it.

Re: Facebook Has Been Showing Military Gear Ads Next to “Insurrection” Posts

#146

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 5:20 PM UTC

SauciestGNU wrote: post #125

nataz wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm seeing adds for illegal pistol and rifle suppressors (aka "silencers") only barely disguised as "fuel filters" and "solvent traps". The companies selling the suppressor kits claim they are legitimate auto parts. They clearly aren't. Some people have claimed that it would be legal to buy these if you applied for a license to manufacture a suppressor, but good luck arguing that in federal court, especially since th…

I'm going to be pedantic, but in the US, those silencer kits can be legal. There are requirements for the provenance of the components used in them (can't be imported) but until you drill out the bore they're solvent traps or fuel filters. And if you pay for a tax stamp and file the correct paperwork with the ATF, it's completely legal to transform those items into a firearm suppressor.

[deleted]

Re: Facebook Has Been Showing Military Gear Ads Next to “Insurrection” Posts

#147

Post by kipchak » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 5:22 PM UTC

mywittyname wrote: post #107

DIVx0 wrote: post #59

I'll pile on an anecdote. I still have a facebook account but its not something I use very often except the past week given the situation in the USA. My facebook account is very old, when i was more of an active user I did all the usual posts/photos that a lot of liberal urban types contribute. Anyway, after posting some anti-insurrection posts I start noticing all sort of "tacti-cool" gear ads or targeted T-shirt s…

> so my guess is that someone out there is spending a lot of money on a huge ad target I think this is really it. The profit margins on this stuff is insane. And the volumes of money typical people spend on this stuff is also insane. (speculation here) The insurrection is probably opening the door for new customers. I would not be surprised to hear a people in zero-gun households are now seeking to acquire their firs…

> I would not be surprised to hear a people in zero-gun households are now seeking to acquire their first one.

About 40% of sales in 2020[1] were to first time owners, I think it's a fairly safe bet 2021 will increase those numbers.

[1]https://www.nssf.org/first-time-gun-buyers-grow-to-nearly-5-...

Re: Facebook Has Been Showing Military Gear Ads Next to “Insurrection” Posts

#148

Post by LargoLasskhyfv » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 5:23 PM UTC

manigandham wrote: post #120

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why the solution is liability: Companies will keep leaving unchecked algorithms responsible for this until they can go to jail for doing so. Adtech is a cancer and it's time to cut it out using every legislative and regulatory option we have. Put Mark Zuckerberg and Sundar Pichai behind bars and the problem will correct after that.

Liability for what exactly? How about people who actually commit bad acts are the ones responsible for it? It seems like you haven't really thought about this and are just personally against adtech and those companies. That's not how rights and legislation should be decided.

Hm. OK. Let's compare this with how child pornography is handled, be it its distribution, or posession, not to speak of the production.

Do you still think your position has merit? :-)

Re: Facebook Has Been Showing Military Gear Ads Next to “Insurrection” Posts

#149

Post by libertine » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 5:23 PM UTC

Daniel_sk wrote: post #135

libertine wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The most baffling thing to me is the fact that body armor, and military grade weapons, are sold in USA... Like, we're discussing ad delivery, not the fact that a country allows companies to sell all kinds of weapons, and equipment to the general public... so I think that accurate ad targeting is the least of the problems.

Body armor, helmets and any sort of protective gear is legal in most parts of world, and I would bet any EU state (and in case of my EU country I can buy an AR-15 or any sort of semi-automatic weapon).

Such protective equipment might be legal in most parts of the world, but they have a small market - the ad in the article is selling it like any regular product... literally they say "The survival gear that you are missing!", like it's some pillow being sold for a good night sleep.

It's just odd.

>I would bet any EU state (and in case of my EU country I can buy an AR-15 or any sort of semi-automatic weapon)

Well in the case of my EU country we can't buy AR-15 or any semi-automatic rifle. The weapons owned here are mostly for hunting, not for sports/self defense.

Re: Facebook Has Been Showing Military Gear Ads Next to “Insurrection” Posts

#150

Post by arcticbull » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 5:23 PM UTC

anovikov wrote: post #108

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why the solution is liability: Companies will keep leaving unchecked algorithms responsible for this until they can go to jail for doing so. Adtech is a cancer and it's time to cut it out using every legislative and regulatory option we have. Put Mark Zuckerberg and Sundar Pichai behind bars and the problem will correct after that.

But only real alternative to adtech is spam: cheap (because of very low effectiveness), flashy rows of banner ads, 1990s style. I am old enough to remember how obnoxious internet experience was ~20 years ago before targeted ads became a thing. It sucked.

That’s a false dichotomy. The only thing that ad tech gets you is specific targeting on a per user basis. You can still advertise related products and services based on the context in which the ads are presented without needing to know the marital status age range and skin color of the person doing the viewing.