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Facebook Incubated the Insurrection

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Re: Facebook Incubated the Insurrection

#151

Post by vorpalhex »

mlang23 wrote: post #139
o_1 wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this is literally the worst parallel I've ever heard. guns are deterant against serious bodily harm. You've obviously never been in a situation when someone else was threatening your life. A better assumption is maybe Parler was a deterant from suppression. I love how parler criticism existed in 24hrs after "trump" ban. I was on the platform for months non of this hainiss violence or racism was ever in my feed.

Indeed, I was never in a situation where someone threatened my life. I know why. I life in a first world country. With reasonable people, and proper gun control laws. The gun laws are what make me consider the USA not a safe place.

Because the UK and EU have no murders, rapes, assaults, etc?

At some point you've crossed from hyperbole into just waging a culture war. Remember that the goal is to evolve both sides understanding in a disagreement, not shout loudly at the other person until they walk away.

Re: Facebook Incubated the Insurrection

#152

Post by asxd »

lesstenseflow wrote: post #132
andrewzah wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Intent does matter. Why don't you try moderating posts at the scale facebook receives them, and we can compare the results. edit: I am not advocating for or against facebook being so large. What I am saying is there is a clear distinction between facebook and e.g. parler in terms of moderation.

Respectfully, this is bullshit. As mentioned above, the question was about dollars, cents, and optics. Parler costs nothing to cut & there's little PR hit (probably a benefit), Cutting Facebook would cost the platforms money. The "terms of use violations" or whatever BS they're referencing for booting Parler doesn't even enter into it, the action is based at least 99% on cost/benefit to the platform, not some sanitar…

> So let's not play dumb and assert that this is about some fixed set of rules

I think that's exactly what makes this such a complex issue. It's unprecedented. Never in the past have social media companies been suddenly used as an outlet for national leaders.

> the tech chiefs are clearly making the rules up as they go along

Again, to the above point, this is obviously the case. There's no fixed set of rules to perfectly mediate this situation and appease everybody. It's going to be a bit fluid.

Re: Facebook Incubated the Insurrection

#153

Post by coffeefirst »

goto11 wrote: post #25
zests wrote: post #11

Yes, social media and maybe even the internet as a whole will radicalize its users. Facebook is a groupthink incubator. So is hacker news. I've witnessed many people change their political beliefs to match whichever group they belong to.

In what direction does HN radicalize us?

It makes certain ideas look more common than they are.

For example, if you've been hanging around here for the last few months, you might pick up on a sizable percentage of the population believes that paying people who live in SF more than people who live in Minneapolis is literally the worst thing ever.

Radicalizing is the wrong word, but this is a pretty strange bubble and it's easy to lose sight of that.

Re: Facebook Incubated the Insurrection

#154

Post by darkcha0s »

pjkundert wrote: post #126
x86_64Ubuntu wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Parler, unlike Facebook, only existed to foment the kinds of rhetoric and ideologies that lead to the 6th.

Not to provide facts to counter your generalizations, but... I was on Parler for several months, trawling it and other sources quite heavily for the last month or so, trying to keep abreast of ... events. At no time did I see even a single post advocating violent overthrow of the government, white supremacy, etc. Apparently, neither did any of those planning the Capital attack, since they were not Parler members. So,…

https://www.theverge.com/2021/1/13/22228675/amazon-parler-ta...

Just some examples of those non-existent violent posts

Re: Facebook Incubated the Insurrection

#155

Post by pjkundert »

jf22 wrote: post #150
pjkundert wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to provide facts to counter your generalizations, but... I was on Parler for several months, trawling it and other sources quite heavily for the last month or so, trying to keep abreast of ... events. At no time did I see even a single post advocating violent overthrow of the government, white supremacy, etc. Apparently, neither did any of those planning the Capital attack, since they were not Parler members. So,…

Instead of relying on first hand experience, have you considered googling for screen shots of Parler posts advocating for the violent overthrow of government and white supremacy? They exist and are easy to find.

Of course they are.

They are easy to find for every platform.

Re: Facebook Incubated the Insurrection

#156

Post by rootusrootus »

lesstenseflow wrote: post #143
asxd wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I won't pretend to be close to the matter, but my understanding was Parler's value proposition to users was that they wouldn't moderate as heavily?

There's a lot of space between "what violates the law" (or explicit ios/play store Terms of Use for that matter) and "what will get you kicked off twitter" and I believe Parler operated in that space. Users could post stuff that would get them booted off twitter, but that was legal speech. This was fine with iOS & play store & AWS until they all simultaneously and independently (wink wink) realized it violated their…

> Users could post stuff that would get them booted off twitter, but that was legal speech

I'm curious what kind of posts would definitely fall into this distinction. I see plenty of really distasteful, vile comments show up on Twitter. And AFAIK inciting violence is illegal. So the area between those seems to me like it would be pretty narrow.

My impression of Parler is more that they only deleted illegal speech of a particularly egregious nature, e.g. child porn.

Re: Facebook Incubated the Insurrection

#157

Post by RcouF1uZ4gsC »

shlant wrote: post #60
mrweasel wrote: post #14

So is Google going to throw them out of the Play store? What's the argument for banning one social media and not another. Where do you draw the line that manages to keep Facebooks app available, while still being able to defend the removal of Parler. I know many will think I'm defending Parler, I'm not. I just don't see why Facebook is continuously given a free pass for all the horrible stuff on their platform. Is it…

I don't deny there is probably some favoritism going on, but is Facebooks willingness to moderate their content not at least part of the reason? Parler was completely hands off when it came to any sort of moderation of the content its users were posting (by design) which allowed for threats of violence to go unchecked and flourish within the platform. That seems like a pretty significant determinant when considering…

>but is Facebooks willingness to moderate their content not at least part of the reason?

At some level, for these type of issues, intent doesn’t really matter, only results. I am sure big oil companies do t intend to cause global warming, however they put profits ahead of any concern for pollution. Same with Facebook. I am sure they don’t intend to be harmful and toxic, but at some level they put profits ahead of any concern for pollution.

Re: Facebook Incubated the Insurrection

#158

Post by 55555 »

mlang23 wrote: post #133
cal5k wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That’s why you can buy a set of knives on Amazon but not a 10 pack of Glocks. No, it's because Amazon doesn't sell guns. There's also no reason to own 10 of the same firearm - it's not like you're setting your dinner table with handguns. As for guns being "mostly used to kill people", that's just not true. My gun collection has only been used to kill paper targets and, occasionally, deer. Properly used they are no…

People who keep a personal "gun collection" should be put under permanent sourveilance. A weekly psychology test included.

Why? And what about people who keep a knife collection?

Re: Facebook Incubated the Insurrection

#160

Post by jwond »

jf22 wrote: post #150
pjkundert wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to provide facts to counter your generalizations, but... I was on Parler for several months, trawling it and other sources quite heavily for the last month or so, trying to keep abreast of ... events. At no time did I see even a single post advocating violent overthrow of the government, white supremacy, etc. Apparently, neither did any of those planning the Capital attack, since they were not Parler members. So,…

Instead of relying on first hand experience, have you considered googling for screen shots of Parler posts advocating for the violent overthrow of government and white supremacy? They exist and are easy to find.

There also exist plenty of screenshots of Twitter and Facebook posts advocating violence and racial supremacy.
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