Workaholism leads to health problems, work addiction risk depends on occupation • Hacker News Board

Re: Workaholism leads to health problems, work addiction risk depends on occupation

#201

Post by rodgerd » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 4:32 AM UTC

agumonkey wrote: post #154

bitbuilder wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure a lot of us can relate. One of my best memories from my career: I was sitting at my desk at 8pm "working" because I had "so much to do". When in reality I was just dreading going home. A coworker that I barely new dropped by my desk and said "Things aren't going well at home, are they? Me either." We proceeded to head across the street to a bar to share stories. It helped immensely at that time. I make an ef…

I wonder if other cultures or other eras knew how to deal with that better. Ignoring and distracting problems through side gigs...

Once again I find myself recommending Bullshit Jobs.

But beyond that, I'd add Bertrand Russell's In Praise of Idleness and Emmanuel Le Roy Ladurie's Montaillou: Cathars and Catholics in a French Village 1294-1324.

While all of them are tremendous food for thought, the third was the most stunning for me: it is remarkable to see the degree to which a medieval peasant, while having less access to technology than we do today, enjoyed in many ways a better lifestyle than we do in terms of holidays, working hours that meshed with actual human rythyms. As Russell spells out, the industrial revolution, which provided many material advancement, could have done so with a great improvement in everyone's lifestyle, but instead most of its benefits have been captured upwards.

Re: Workaholism leads to health problems, work addiction risk depends on occupation

#202

Post by exclusiv » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 4:32 AM UTC

Dudeman112 wrote: post #159

exclusiv wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That makes more sense to me than the other way around. As a workaholic, and learnaholic, I did it as a path to financial freedom and to accelerate my learning at at time I knew I had the bandwidth and will. It made me a better entrepreneur and business owner later, which is what I really wanted to do. But as I've gotten older and have a family now I've been removing obligations for my businesses. And working more nor…

Except most people don't already spend 40h per week reading books or practicing their crafts. If they spent 47h per week doing it, people would call it unhealthy too. (or dedicated, if they have no sense of healthy temperance at all)

> Except most people don't already spend 40h per week reading books or practicing their crafts.

If someone does the average only (40 hrs) and does 7 hours of personal learning on their craft in their spare time - nobody would consider them a workaholic. That's what I'm trying to say.

I work more than the average just like many on this board. Well guess what? I'm more skilled than the average. And I have a wider range of skills than most (from software engineering to marketing). I didn't get there by clocking 40 at each role or at my own businesses. And I probably wouldn't have been able to build successful businesses without going deep into learning for years ahead of time.

To many - the extra work hours are a focus on their craft and learning. I'll add marketing tech skills. Or customer acquisition skills. Or finance.

If I was reading marketing books for 7 hours per week that wouldn't be equated with working. That would be called learning.

And to many people - that's a huge part of their life.

Just because my hobby or thirst of information may include "work", doesn't mean people with knitting hobbies after they clock out 40 have a better work/life balance.

To me - some of my work is a hobby because I find it fascinating and I'll explore different industries much like someone may explore different cuisines in their home chef hobby.

Also - I still have more regular hobbies than most people I know, because apart from some Hacker News time, I don't spend 2-3 hours daily on social media like most people.

I don't get the work/life movement (apart from employer abuse of some employees).

Do you truly enjoy your life or not? Life balance is more appropriate to consider.

Re: Workaholism leads to health problems, work addiction risk depends on occupation

#203

Post by nbs_tar » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 4:51 AM UTC

CONDUCTED IN FRANCE?!

Re: Workaholism leads to health problems, work addiction risk depends on occupation

#204

Post by ZephyrBlu » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 4:51 AM UTC

r00fus wrote: post #157

lqet wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "Man what's up with frank today?" > "Oh he was pulling an all-nighter doing a non-urgent task." > "Did anybody ask him to?" > "No. In fact we asked him to stop." When I am doing this, it is usually because I have the strong feeling that I am in complete control of the problem right now , hours after midnight. Two fears then kick it: will I make it to this point of control a second time in the near future (3-6 month…

After you create your masterpiece of code, do you know enough to document and understand it later (so you can pass it on to others)? Having been in the zone, I completely sympathize with the view that productivity isn't constant; that the cost to your health is worth the leap... Have you ever had that feeling and then realized in the morning/next day that your feeling was illusory and you actually took the harder pat…

For me it's more about getting the idea out of my head. The code wouldn't be a finished product, but more like a brain dump.

Re: Workaholism leads to health problems, work addiction risk depends on occupation

#205

Post by justathrowa » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 5:39 AM UTC

robocat wrote: post #135

justathrowa wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>But that doesn't mean it is a healthy way to spend all of your time. Dunno about that. Just a personal anecdote, but this year my boss specifically told me to work less, slashing my salary down by $10,000 a year to emphasize the point. Prior to this, 200 to 240 hours a month was pretty typical and has been for the last 8 years. (I doubt it's out of real concern for my health, my workload hasn't been reduced). What I…

Working on how you would commit suicide is a very strong signal you are in mortal danger, according to my friend a nurse with experience. Your problem to solve is: ‘what will make my life worthwhile.’ Make it your job to solve that and spend time and money(=stored time) to do so. The alternative job of how to end your life is a poor goal, IMHO. You can pay someone to care about you (edit: and has the skills to be use…

I think there's been some misunderstanding. If I'm understanding you correctly, you seem to believe that the issue is that I'm lonely, and it's not a bad assumption but it's not entirely correct. I grew up without friends, my parents forbade me from making friends from childhood until I was done university and by then for the most part I was, and still am, fine with being alone.

>Finally, if you must commit suicide, please do it so that it plausibly looks like an accident.

I had a few ideas, but the only semi feasible one I thought of so far was to mix heavy alcohol intoxication and hypothermia. Hypothermia is uncomfortable until you start loosing your mental faculties. The alcohol might be able to cover for the discomfort but I haven't tested that particular combination. And there's a slight concern about the poor sap that comes across my body.

Fentanyl overdose is probably the next option but I lack the necessary friends-of-friends to acquire some. And there isn't a way of testing the timing or potency against the time of arrival of EMT's that seem to carry Narcan in their pockets.

I'm open to hearing ideas if you have any though.

Re: Workaholism leads to health problems, work addiction risk depends on occupation

#206

Post by bitcoinmoney » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 5:42 AM UTC

climb_stealth wrote: post #187

simplestman wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This describes me, sort of. I feel more and more lack of control over my personal life. My parents have become demanding and mean as they have gotten old. My wife wants to get a bigger home while I don't think we can afford it. But I am too tired of arguing, so just giving in and going to get whatever she wants. My son loves and I love him more than anything, but when I am not working, he wants to do everything with…

FWIW I found couple therapy very helpful. Especially around the feeling of lack of control in the relationship and not being able to fulfill my needs or being able to ask for them. It really helps to have someone independent who has both parties' interests in mind and who can a) see what is healthy in the relationship and what isn't, b) help with talking about invidivual needs, c) bridge the gap between the two peopl…

How do you find a therapist?

Re: Workaholism leads to health problems, work addiction risk depends on occupation

#207

Post by bitcoinmoney » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 5:51 AM UTC

justathrowa wrote: post #56

honkycat wrote: post #30

Most of the time I've seen it, it is avoidance of the rest of their life. "Change diapers? Oh, sorry honey, I uhh... gotta do this thing at work. Darn it!" One phenomenon I've always noticed about workaholics is that they THINK they are being more productive, but often times they are just spending more time spinning their wheels. Also the effect it has on their mood/interpersonal skills, and the pressure it puts on t…

>But that doesn't mean it is a healthy way to spend all of your time. Dunno about that. Just a personal anecdote, but this year my boss specifically told me to work less, slashing my salary down by $10,000 a year to emphasize the point. Prior to this, 200 to 240 hours a month was pretty typical and has been for the last 8 years. (I doubt it's out of real concern for my health, my workload hasn't been reduced). What I…

Please reach out to a friend or professional. You can DM me if you want.

Re: Workaholism leads to health problems, work addiction risk depends on occupation

#208

Post by david_allison » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 5:55 AM UTC

wruza wrote: post #28

markus_zhang wrote: post #6

I believe workaholists do not neccesarily love their job, but hate something else so much that they would rather find some place to take a bit of rest. I think I'm developing into one...

I went on vacation from mid-December and returned to work a few days ago (no lockdown here, office worker). I spent the entire "vacation" in pain, weakness, and/or headaches, but now they are gone (as is the money spent on treatment). I need to check if this has anything to do with my shitty home chair and couch or just being in the office. It would be very nice if the problem was in the furniture. Upd: no, it’s not…

Do you have a carbon monoxide detector?

Re: Workaholism leads to health problems, work addiction risk depends on occupation

#209

Post by stonecharioteer » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 6:08 AM UTC

laurent92 wrote: post #90

markus_zhang wrote: post #6

I believe workaholists do not neccesarily love their job, but hate something else so much that they would rather find some place to take a bit of rest. I think I'm developing into one...

Now that you are not at the top, I can say it: I have the theory that boys get into programming as a form of escapism – because the external world is frustrating to them. It is certainly my case, external world has all sorts of illogic demands, things that exist but should not be explicited, social rules, or various insults and condescension, some of them because we’re boys (my sister used to tell me boys have 13% fe…

Oh wow. This hits it on the nail. Some of the teachers who understood how to teach me were male. Only one woman knew how to teach me. In India, school teachers are almost always women. I turned to programming as soon as I got a computer. I also read a lot of escapist fiction. Fiction that wasn't based in India or in the real world. Tolkien, Eddings, Robert Jordan, Terry Brook, Agatha Christie (I know but her books weren't based in our time so I seemed to see it as escapism).

Thanks for making the effort to point this out. Do you have any reading material on the topic?

Re: Workaholism leads to health problems, work addiction risk depends on occupation

#210

Post by redisman » Thu, Jan 14, 2021, 6:36 AM UTC

scyzoryk_xyz wrote: post #125

exclusiv wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's different for entrepreneur workaholics. Your startup is your baby. It's fun. It's challenging. It's rewarding. And when you're young I think it's great to dedicate to work. You accelerate your learning. You make more money. You meet smart people. I don't know anyone very knowledgeable and skilled for their age that did a work/life balance route. If you are a workaholic but also a learnaholic, then I don'…

You do know that social media is not the only thing one can do outside of work, right? Like, there are ways of spending time living that don’t revolve around trying to make “gains”; social, financial or any other kind. Maybe this is something that your parents mean - they’re expressing a worry over whether you’re getting value out of life, as you’re hustling through all those businesses you seem to be running? I noti…

Hilarious how the parent comment seems to categorize the whole rest of life on earth as “meh they’re probably on Facebook”. You know there’s nature, art, other intellectual pursuits, people, using your body in various ways etc.