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Why is America the 'no-vacation nation'?

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Re: Why is America the 'no-vacation nation'?

#41

Post by patja »

Taking control of my own schedule is in the top 5 list of reasons I quit being an employee 4 years ago (constant reorganization was number 1). Now I take all of August off, spend time volunteering in my daughters' classrooms during the day, get all of my errands done while the streets and shops are empty, and generally love life a lot more.

Anyone with dev skills can go independent or strike out with a group of like-minded souls to take control of their schedule. Sure there are downsides to working on your own, and it isn't all skittles and beer, but overall I find it well worth it.

Re: Why is America the 'no-vacation nation'?

#43

Post by nixy »

tjogin wrote: post #38
nixy wrote: post #26

I'm a Swedish developer. This year I have 7 weeks of vacation, and I plan to use it all. I normally get the 5 weeks required by law. Last year, I only used 4 of those 5 weeks, so one spilled over to this year. I also got a bonus week of vacation for working a lot of overtime last summer. So that makes 7 weeks.

Also please note that this is paid vacation we're talking about. In Sweden, we have five weeks of vacation by law. And, the right to take four of those weeks consecutively .

Indeed. It's not only paid, but I get 112% of my normal salary during vacation because your living expenses increase when you're on holiday.

Re: Why is America the 'no-vacation nation'?

#44

Post by theBobMcCormick »

joezydeco wrote: post #10

I'm wondering how much of it is because people neglect to negotiate their vacation time when changing jobs. Most American workplaces start you out with 2 weeks and then usually add a week or so after so many years of seniority. When you change jobs, how many of you ask for that same amount of vacation time at the new company? Or do you just accept that you're new and don't want to push things by asking for more at th…

I've got a co-worker who negotiated extra time of when he started here (3 weeks instead of the normal 2). Normally, we get an extra week of vacation after 5 years of employment. Unfortunately, they screwed him out of it because he already had 3 weeks, which is the normal amount for someone with 5 years of tenure. :-(

Re: Why is America the 'no-vacation nation'?

#45

Post by barrkel »

pavel_lishin wrote: post #35
wladimir wrote: post #21

This is crazy from our (Western European) perspective. It was one of my reasons for not taking a job in the USA that was offered me a few years ago. Yes, it paid somewhat more than here in Europe but I'd rather have the benefits such as more free time and better health care than more income.

I can't speak for the health care, but I imagine that you could have negotiated for better vacation time.

It strongly depends on the company. Many companies use vacation time as a perk strictly for seniority, and are inflexible about changing it; or if you do get a break, you forego further increases until your seniority has "caught up".

It's pretty stupid, particularly since it's a fairly strong disincentive to relocate: precisely after you've moved away from friends and family, they give you less time to visit them. It was one of the biggest reasons I never moved to CA when I had the offer, H-1B, etc.

Re: Why is America the 'no-vacation nation'?

#46

Post by patja »

joss82 wrote: post #14
leftnode wrote: post #9

There is a good article from another software developer around here who told his boss he was taking a 3 month vacation. He made the point the business needed him more than he needed it; he was a competent developer and could easily get work, didn't have any living/large financial dependencies. At first I thought it was absurd, but the more I thought about it, he was absolutely correct. Take a long vacation some time.…

Here it is, and it's awesome: http://www.expatsoftware.com/articles/2007/02/two-weeks-vaca...

That is a good story, and I know as a manager I granted more than a few unpaid personal leaves of absence for top employees. Way better to have them come back refreshed and productive than to try to replace their domain knowledge with a new hire! It won't work for everyone though...but is a good litmus test of how much your employer values you.

It is also a solid testimony to the fact that for every HR policy there is an exception. If you are valued and make your case in the right way, you can get a lot! (think double-promotions, out of cycle raises, better gear, etc.) HR advises, Managers decide (if your manager doesn't know this, shop for a new one)

Re: Why is America the 'no-vacation nation'?

#47

Post by PonyGumbo »

jinushaun wrote: post #6
wccrawford wrote: post #4

When I complained to an employer that it was too hard to request my vacation time (it's in my contract, they made it very hard to pick dates by always having an emergency deadline, etc) they replied "It's like that everywhere", as if it was a legit answer. Many employers also lump in sick time with vacation time, as if that's a replacement since you didn't come into work. That would probably be okay, if you had an op…

What really grinds my gears is when federal holidays count towards my "vacation time". Those alone eat up seven days! I request four weeks of vacation in my contract, but am afraid to use them. That's America.

I started a new job last year with 10 days of vacation. It wasn't until December that I learned that five of those days were mandatory for the week between Christmas and New Year's. If you had no vacation days left, it was unpaid time off.

Re: Why is America the 'no-vacation nation'?

#48

Post by odiroot »

toyg wrote: post #20

It wasn't always like this in Europe. Extended vacation time was one of the many hard-fought rights won by the socialist/trade-unionist movements of the past century throughout the continent. Not even Thatcher dared attacking that right (she dropped a few national holidays here and there, instead). Things didn't turn out quite the same on the other side of the pond, sadly, and this is the result.

That may be true but here, in Europe (esp. Eastern), many people go years without taking more than few days of vacation. One, you're discouraged to take time off -- you can lose your job if you're not "devoted". Two, you have to work over capacity to support yourself and your family.

Re: Why is America the 'no-vacation nation'?

#50

Post by barrkel »

skittles wrote: post #22

I work for a company that doesn't have expiring vacation days. They are payed out at 100% at your current salary the day you quit, get fired, or retire. We have a large amount of employees that use this as an additional retirement account. I can't imagine banking all my vacation time!

That's a dangerous strategy to rely on. The company may not ultimately be able to afford such payouts.
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