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Visa and Plaid Abandon Merger After Antitrust Division’s Suit to Block

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201–210 of 295 posts

Re: Visa and Plaid Abandon Merger After Antitrust Division’s Suit to Block

#201

Whatever you think about Visa or this merger, this would be a major disappoint to Plaid's team members who thought they were in for a huge financial windfall. If that applies to anyone here, my sympathies and best of luck figuring out what's next for Plaid. Hopefully the morale hit isn't too big on the team.

This comment strikes a nerve with me - perhaps because it's "saying the quiet part loud". I thought the typical goal of hackers and startups was to "change the world" and "make a difference". How does selling to Visa accomplish those things? Isn't expressing sympathy with Plaid's staff for not getting a payout effectively saying "sorry that you might actually have to deliver on the lofty promises this time"? It's als…

I'm doing it to get paid. Yeah, I also want to make a great product and all that but..

Also, I'm getting paid.

Re: Visa and Plaid Abandon Merger After Antitrust Division’s Suit to Block

#202
post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also, giving your credentials to any third party, including Plaid, voids the warranty at many financial institutions. If your account gets hacked and your money stolen, you may find out that the zero liability policy no longer applies to you. The trouble is, giving someone your account number also makes it not the bank's problem what they do with that number, even if it was clearly unauthorized by you. There's no g…

You are guaranteed a minimum of 30 days to contest an ACH charge. 2 days for businesses.

Return timeframe is 60 days for Unauthorized Debit.

Re: Visa and Plaid Abandon Merger After Antitrust Division’s Suit to Block

#203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That was 2018 though when they were barely setting up.

And still the case from what I've heard.

Plaid can very well not use the data in this way, but any company using Plaid's APIs and gaining access to the end-user bank account can do whatever they want with the data. There are no restrictions on potential bad actors who will do this, and no consumer protections.

Re: Visa and Plaid Abandon Merger After Antitrust Division’s Suit to Block

#204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are getting sued by TD Bank for this very reason: > The bank said in the court filings that the interface "dupes" consumers into believing they are entering personal information into TD Bank's trusted platform. > "In reality, however, consumers are unwittingly giving their login credentials to the defendant, who takes the information, stores it on its servers, and uses it to mine consumers' bank records for valu…

I am sure I will be called naive, but this is shocking to me. I assumed that Plaid was integrating with the banks and not doing this sort of thing because of the people associated with Plaid. Their seed round included Spark Capital and Google Ventures. Their most recent round included Mary Meeker and Andreessen Horowitz. [1] These investors have reputations to protect. This type of thing would certainly come out in d…

They do integrate natively with some banks, like JPMC:

> When this is implemented, Plaid will access customer information through the bank’s secure API (application programming interface) connection. That will allow customers to share their information more safely and quickly with Plaid and the financial apps it supports while protecting their bank username and password.

and also Wells Fargo:

> The API used in the agreement will utilize a more secure, tokenized “handshake” between the companies’ servers through which customers’ financial data will be shared. Once integrated, the API will allow customers to share their financial data, while also maintaining the privacy of their user credentials. The enrollment process will be easy and designed to work seamlessly within Plaid-supported apps’ user experiences.

I think it would be good to do some quick Google searches before getting (all of) the torches out.

https://media.chase.com/news/plaid-signs-data-agreement-with...

https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20190919005081/en/Wel...

Re: Visa and Plaid Abandon Merger After Antitrust Division’s Suit to Block

#205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also, giving your credentials to any third party, including Plaid, voids the warranty at many financial institutions. If your account gets hacked and your money stolen, you may find out that the zero liability policy no longer applies to you. The trouble is, giving someone your account number also makes it not the bank's problem what they do with that number, even if it was clearly unauthorized by you. There's no g…

I don't buy this. If I give someone a check (which has an account number on it) that doesn't mean they get to withdraw whatever they want from my bank account. What bank in the U.S. wont reverse fraudulent ACH debits?

Actually, if you hand someone a check they indeed can just use your account and routing number to pay for things using ACH.

Hence why I avoid ever linking my bank to anything.

Re: Visa and Plaid Abandon Merger After Antitrust Division’s Suit to Block

#206
post #75

I’ve some friends that works there, so I’m hesitant to say this, because I’m sorry for them, but Plaid is a terrible company. Their main product scrapes financial data from unsuspecting users that simply think they’re making a bank transfer and not signing away the privacy and security of their banking, 401k and trading information. https://twitter.com/seanieb/status/1298871471645761537?s=20

FWIW their competitor Teller uses the bank's own native APIs.

The idea is the bank can't shut off Teller clients without shutting off their own customers. This involves a lot of iOS reverse engineering.

So things like Plaid's Capital One integration breaking for months have never happened with Teller - who've been running for something like 5 years now.

https://teller.io/

Re: Visa and Plaid Abandon Merger After Antitrust Division’s Suit to Block

#207
post #75

I’ve some friends that works there, so I’m hesitant to say this, because I’m sorry for them, but Plaid is a terrible company. Their main product scrapes financial data from unsuspecting users that simply think they’re making a bank transfer and not signing away the privacy and security of their banking, 401k and trading information. https://twitter.com/seanieb/status/1298871471645761537?s=20

As someone who's worked in fintech for 10 years, I think this is a bad take. Out of all aggregators (what this is called), Plaid is by far the most open and privacy-forward.

First, they're transparent about being a 3rd party that's part of the flow (see https://plaid.com/blog/the-all-new-plaid-link/). It's clear it's Plaid, they use neutral colors and not the bank's, etc. They have a portal where you can manage your data (https://my.plaid.com/).

Second, they are very open about not selling data (unlike most of the their competitors). It's in their terms and their website (see https://plaid.com/how-we-handle-data/). I guess that could change, but from working with them I know it's part of their positioning so I'd be surprised if that changed.

Third, they've announced bank integrations and afaik they're moving to OAuth where the banks support it (I've seen this in the wild, but can't replicate right now). The key here is where banks support it. I think you have to look at the historical context: the banks do not want you to own your data as a consumer. They don't want fintech apps to exist. Having talked to banks about integrating directly with them, it's onerous and only the big players can do it. Plaid's fighting the good fight for fintech startups.

But yeah it's a less-than-ideal solution and it sucks that it doesn't work without creds flowing through and it's not clear regulators or banks will work to make it better. That sucks. I just think bashing on Plaid here is one-sided.

(throwaway account because I work in fintech)

Re: Visa and Plaid Abandon Merger After Antitrust Division’s Suit to Block

#208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also, giving your credentials to any third party, including Plaid, voids the warranty at many financial institutions. If your account gets hacked and your money stolen, you may find out that the zero liability policy no longer applies to you. The trouble is, giving someone your account number also makes it not the bank's problem what they do with that number, even if it was clearly unauthorized by you. There's no g…

I don't buy this. If I give someone a check (which has an account number on it) that doesn't mean they get to withdraw whatever they want from my bank account. What bank in the U.S. wont reverse fraudulent ACH debits?

> What bank in the U.S. wont reverse fraudulent ACH debits?

Ah that’s the key though, you have to tell them to reverse it. I think you have 60 days in most cases. But the onus is on you to dispute the debit.

Re: Visa and Plaid Abandon Merger After Antitrust Division’s Suit to Block

#210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am sure I will be called naive, but this is shocking to me. I assumed that Plaid was integrating with the banks and not doing this sort of thing because of the people associated with Plaid. Their seed round included Spark Capital and Google Ventures. Their most recent round included Mary Meeker and Andreessen Horowitz. [1] These investors have reputations to protect. This type of thing would certainly come out in d…

I'm surprised, because Plaid is far from the first mover in the "scraped banking data API" space. Mint (now Intuit) and Yodlee come to mind, and they use essentially the same sign-in flow and come with the same limitations. There are organizations and companies that are trying to do this legitimately, through open standards and real incentives to both FIs and customers to share information in exchanges: - Open Bankin…

Re: formatting, I strongly suggest using markdown's [reference link syntax], which is much more readable when rendered as plain text.

[reference link syntax]: https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/basics

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