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Airbus hit as new US tariffs come into force

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Re: Airbus hit as new US tariffs come into force

#191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a long series of tit-for-tat tariffs and subsidies. Not particularly novel and has persisted between multiple administrations. Honestly, I'm surprised it took this long following the WTO ruling: https://www.cnbc.com/2019/10/02/wto-rules-in-favor-of-us-in-...

Sure but the context has changed.

Yes. It was still pretty much just a Boeing vs. Airbus dispute arbitrated by the WTO until the EU did this: https://www.capitalpress.com/nation_world/agriculture/eu-imp... in response to the US trying to implement the aforementioned WTO ruling.

Re: Airbus hit as new US tariffs come into force

#192

Isn't it a 15% tax on aircraft parts (the 25% tax is on wine)? The first sentence of the article is "The United States is, from today, levying a 15% duty on imported aircraft parts coming from France and Germany."

The submitted title was "US imposes 25% Tarriff on importing aircraft parts from Europe". Submitters: please observe the site guidelines, which include: "Please use the original title, unless it is misleading or linkbait; don't editorialize." One reason we have that rule is to avoid errors like this one.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Airbus hit as new US tariffs come into force

#193
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Should just nationalize it then. Otherwise propping up a company like that is anti-freemarket.

Freemarkets exist in fairytales.

Please don't take HN threads on generic ideological tangents. There's nothing new to say about any of them and they inevitably degrade as they go—perhaps because the mind looks to conflict to amuse itself in the absence of any new information.

Yes, the GP comment went halfway there but that's not a good reason to go the whole hog.

https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor...

https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor...

Re: Airbus hit as new US tariffs come into force

#194
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's to penalize AirBus for being propped by France and Germany, supposedly. Wine and liquor got caught up in the mix somehow too.

It's all due to digital taxing companies like Apple, Google, Amazon. France put in a 3% tax on digital services, some other countries did it as well. The EU as a whole plans to do a 3% tax on all digital services in 2021. The US is angry about it, since all the major tech companies happen to be american.

> it's all due to digital taxing companies like Apple, Google, Amazon.

Citation needed.

Isn't this just part of: https://www.wto.org/english/tratop_e/dispu_e/cases_e/ds316_e...

It is beyond the scope of this settlement?

Re: Airbus hit as new US tariffs come into force

#195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect most Fords sold in the EU are manufactured in the EU or its former member state: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_of_Europe

Correct, I think only the Mustang, the Ranger and Edge are imported from the US, nice vehicles (especially the Mustang the Ranger) but which don't sell that much in absolute numbers. The rest of their line-up is I think produced in Europe.

Most of Ford's car lineup, even in the US, was designed in the EU (fiesta, focus) or in collaboration with Mazda (fusion). Cars like the Taurus/500/Montego/MKS evolved from Volvo platforms.

Ford is pretty heavily involved in Europe. Cars are bigger in Europe, so Ford cars tend to be developed there, while trucks and SUVs are bigger in America, so design of these vehicles is largely done in America.

Re: Airbus hit as new US tariffs come into force

#196

Is this an attempt to prop up Boeing from collapse? Really lame solution if so.

The EU subsidized Airbus for decades to enable it to compete with Boeing. China does the same with many of their industries. Japan and Korea did the same before them. Every country has an interest in having strong industry.

[deleted]

Re: Airbus hit as new US tariffs come into force

#197

Wikipedia has a summary of the history of this shitshow: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Competition_between_Airbus_and...

The irony is that Airbus has also lost a lot of money because of the US sanctions against Iran which wasn't even supported by the EU.

Re: Airbus hit as new US tariffs come into force

#198
post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's all due to digital taxing companies like Apple, Google, Amazon. France put in a 3% tax on digital services, some other countries did it as well. The EU as a whole plans to do a 3% tax on all digital services in 2021. The US is angry about it, since all the major tech companies happen to be american.

> it's all due to digital taxing companies like Apple, Google, Amazon. Citation needed. Isn't this just part of: https://www.wto.org/english/tratop_e/dispu_e/cases_e/ds316_e... It is beyond the scope of this settlement?

https://taxfoundation.org/us-tariffs-on-french-goods-digital...

Re: Airbus hit as new US tariffs come into force

#199
post #8

"Among the goods to see an impact from the widened net of additional duty are European made wines, which will attract a 25% duty, and French and German-made aircraft parts, attracting a 15% tax." As a French person, I can't help but feel like there's some sort of personal attack happening there. Wine and airplanes? Hey, I think you guys forgot to tax cheese and sarcasm while you're at it! Let's hope that a new US adm…

It's genius. French wines are consumed by a tiny portion of Americans, so it basically only affects a small slice of people who don't care if it costs a bit more.

French wine is not more or less expensive than domestic wine; there are cheap and expensive options for both. It does, generally, have a different flavor profile.

I'm nowhere near a 1%er and I strongly prefer the taste of old world wines. Count me among the annoyed.

Re: Airbus hit as new US tariffs come into force

#200

If the whole Covid situation taught us something it's that we need to be more independent of other countries and encourage local production of many goods. Tariffs sound like an easy way to do just that. Tax imports, help local producers. I don't see the problem tbh. All those free trade models ignore the scenario of everyone getting dependent on one exporter and then that exporter either going rouge or having problem…

> It works and is needed. Where is the problem?

The problem is, tariffs don't really work. Not in the long-term.

Tariffs can hurt local producers too. If a company is just so efficient at producing good that they can produce cheaper products inclusive of the tariff, then the local company has no chance. They have no hope of expanding outside of their local markets and they will eventually give up.

Most of the time, tariffs merely act as extra profit margin at the expense of the local economy. So the local company has no incentive to improve. So, in the long-term, tariffs on imported goods are are effect way of destroying local industry. It often drives the competition to fiercely optimize their production, making them substantially more competitive on a global market.

The only time tariffs are effective at protecting a market, is when that market only exists locally, not globally. Thus, preventing any producers from gaining efficiency on the global market before tackling a domestic one.

If you want the government to prop up a local industry, get the government to purchase a large volume of goods from them at a fair, but highly-competitive price. Then the producer has incentive to optimize production because they know exactly how much they can save each year. Decades of small incremental improvements add up.

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