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Why Isn’t Telegram End-to-End Encrypted by Default (2017)

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Re: Why Isn’t Telegram End-to-End Encrypted by Default (2017)

#121

Post by ffpip »

srhngpr wrote: post #116
llimos wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They say it themselves https://faq.whatsapp.com/android/chats/about-google-drive-ba... "Media and messages you back up aren't protected by WhatsApp end-to-end encryption while in Google Drive."

That statement is correct. E2E encryption is only in effect between two devices communicating with each other. The moment the messages leave the app in any capacity (e.g., screenshots, backup, forwarded to another convo/contact, etc.) it is not longer protected by E2E encryption. The backup file itself that is uploaded to iCloud/GDrive is encrypted; see: https://security.stackexchange.com/questions/136072/how-can-...

It used to be encrypted. However, Google and Whatsapp have a deal that states Whatsapp backups dont count towards drive storage quotas. It became plaintext (or at least unencrypted after that)

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/whatsapp-google-drive-back...

Re: Why Isn’t Telegram End-to-End Encrypted by Default (2017)

#123

Post by t-writescode »

kitkat_new wrote: post #101
t-writescode wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Actually setting up a server is not difficult. And yet you point me to a YouTube video, rather than a link on their website. The documentation itself strongly encourages setting up your own server to have your own user information and then federating into a system, and yet, the documentation doesn't seem to describe, in friendly terms, how to do that. It might be easy to set up, but I've had trouble discovering all…

> And yet you point me to a YouTube video, rather than a link on their website. So you can see it > and yet, the documentation doesn't seem to describe, in friendly terms, how to do that. mind to expand that?

Watching that video now.

I can say, without a doubt and with great seriousness, that if you have any control over their documentation process, in the "getting started" and "setting up synapse for yourself" pages, that video should ABSOLUTELY be a part of that. It is orders of magnitude easier to follow.

> mind to expand that?

Imagine you don't know how to use nginx.

Okay, now try to read ANYTHING in any of the numerous github .md files.

Then, just start with this page:

https://github.com/matrix-org/synapse

What's Synapse? You know, I know now; but, where on that page does it say what Synapse is?

On basically every tutorial page, I think there's value in asking "okay, what do I need to know to understand this page?" If the knowledge is important and takes more than a click or maybe two to get that answer, it's too far away for most people, I think.

Again, the YouTube video walking through the steps with the guy talking is AMAZING. I've learned more listening to this than any number of web pages attempting to describe it.

Edit: I find the federation documentation to be very confusing, as well: https://github.com/matrix-org/synapse/blob/develop/docs/fede...

Re: Why Isn’t Telegram End-to-End Encrypted by Default (2017)

#124

Post by thrwway34 »

ffpip wrote: post #122
thrwway34 wrote: post #111

Because Russians want easy access to conversations.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blocking_Telegram_in_Russia

Just a PR stunt - during this 'blocking' Russia Today, their Ministry of Foreign Affairs and other government entities managed to create accounts in Telegram.

Re: Why Isn’t Telegram End-to-End Encrypted by Default (2017)

#125

Post by fuzxi »

noxer wrote: post #104
dhsysusbsjsi wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazingly this is why I’m attracted to Signal and have set all chats to 1 week auto delete. To me text chats should be ephemeral. If I want something to stick around for years, send to email.

The blog post is old. Telegram now has auto delete for chats for e2e chats and even manual delete including deleting your partners messages if you want to (on both sides - obviously not in groups). So yes the quick chat that you dont want to be archived anywhere can be deleted quickly and easily. Ofc this does not prevent the other side from storing it in advance but its rather unlikely and It would no longer be poss…

>manual delete including deleting your partners messages if you want to (on both sides - obviously not in groups

You can delete other people's messages for everyone in the chat if you're an admin of the group.

Re: Why Isn’t Telegram End-to-End Encrypted by Default (2017)

#126

Post by ffpip »

thrwway34 wrote: post #124
ffpip wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blocking_Telegram_in_Russia

Just a PR stunt - during this 'blocking' Russia Today, their Ministry of Foreign Affairs and other government entities managed to create accounts in Telegram.

Because circumventing blocks is easy with Telegram. They weren't able to block the app.

I've used the app. Proxies are a click away. Even an average user can run them with a single click.

Re: Why Isn’t Telegram End-to-End Encrypted by Default (2017)

#127

Post by SulfurHexaFluri »

dhsysusbsjsi wrote: post #39
meibo wrote: post #3

> 1) Users don’t want to lose their entire message history when they lose/change their phones so apps of this kind never become massively popular. I think this is a key point to consider for Signal and the other "good" messengers - there's ways to do secure backups, it just needs to be implemented so well that you won't miss the convenience of Google Drive backups. I tend to fall back on anecdotes a lot, but the firs…

Amazingly this is why I’m attracted to Signal and have set all chats to 1 week auto delete. To me text chats should be ephemeral. If I want something to stick around for years, send to email.

I don't have such a distrust for the people I talk to that this is desirable. I find it pretty cool to scroll through old history and remember what we were up to years ago.

Re: Why Isn’t Telegram End-to-End Encrypted by Default (2017)

#128

Post by 29083011397778 »

FabHK wrote: post #115
pmlnr wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> has kind of ok UI It has a single UI, so it's out. Wire specifically disallows anything 3rd party.

App is available on Android, iOS, Mac, Win, Linux though - what more do you need?

A web-app that doesn't log me out every time I reboot, then warn me I'm "already logged in".

And an Android app that doesn't combine the slowness of iOS and Android would be nice. To be clear - their animations (to me) drag on too long (as one might say about iOS), and UI input takes a noticeable amount of time (which is commonly found on Android apps that aren't well-written).

While this may not be helpful for anyone looking to improve the apps, that's kinda more of the same point - nobody is allowed to make a better client, as it's against the Wire ToS. This is why there's no Matrix bridge.

Re: Why Isn’t Telegram End-to-End Encrypted by Default (2017)

#129

Post by ta1610429351 »

olah_1 wrote: post #99
jswizzy wrote: post #92

Isn't Telegram in Russia and most likel a KGB honeypot

No, Durav made a post about this recently but it was on his Telegram channel. Basically they don't have servers in Russia and it has been banned there in the past.

Durov's servers may be anywhere but his arse is in Russia. That's more than enough leverage for KGB to silent him and/or Telegram at will. Yet, for some inexplicable reason, he still lives in Russia all this time. Food for thought.

Re: Why Isn’t Telegram End-to-End Encrypted by Default (2017)

#130

Post by jtsiskin »

rajinikantham wrote: post #79
scubbo wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> news channels I love getting glimpses of how other people use certain apps. I can't imagine _wanting_ news in my messaging app - that's what my news app is for! Very valuable reminder that our own perspective is not always widespread.

If you're interested in these, you should take a look at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WeChat#Features !

Wow that’s... everything?
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