Live data from Hacker News

NFL player IQ by position

benfry.com

61–70 of 100 posts

Re: NFL player IQ by position

#61
post #6

It may not be anything so complicated as smarter people being closer to the ball. It looks to me as if there is an inverse correlation between IQ and the running speed necessary in a position. So the simplest explanation for this pattern is that running speed and intelligence aren't highly correlated, and you can't simultaneously optimize for both. E.g. you can pick a smart guy to be your center even if he's slow, be…

That may be true. Though you could probably make the case that the optimal physical requirements for a center are rare as well, especially at the NFL level. If those requirements don't correlate with intelligence then centers are being selected partially for intelligence.

From my experience playing football offensive linemen and quarterbacks have significantly higher mental requirements. Personally, I always found keeping a complex offense straight against any potential defense more stressful than actually dealing with the defenders. My role on any given play wasn't set until the ball was snapped (or later). Most skill positions knew what they were supposed to do as soon as the play was called.

Re: NFL player IQ by position

#62

Don’t tell Tufte that I’ve used the radius, not the proportional area, of the circle as the value for each ellipse! A cardinal sin that I’m using in this case to improve proportion and clarify a point. I don't understand why this is okay. I imagine he means it was hard to perceive the difference between correctly scaled circles, but that means the data is close, not that you should misrepresent it. I can see he's wri…

Actually both area and radius are completely meaningless as a representation of intelligence. Perhaps some figure that represents percentile score would work better -- something like an empty glass for 0%, a glass half-full for 50%, etc; or something like the circles that Consumer Reports uses for rating products.

Re: NFL player IQ by position

#63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(I noticed all of the comments you contributed to this community are effectively unsubstantiated racism. I suspect I am wasting my time replying, so I will keep this brief.) "foot speed and intelligence are inversely correlated...'[black people are faster and dumber and white people are slower and smarter]'" You are missing the point entirely. While there is an inverse correlation between footspeed and intelligence i…

The existence of a racial gap in IQ is simply not in dispute. It shows up in SAT scores, it shows up in military IQ tests during times with a draft, and it shows up in numerous psychological studies. See for instance this paper from Brookings Institute, which is about as mainstream liberal as you can get ( http://www.brookings.edu/views/papers/dickens/20060619_iq.pd... ) The only question is if the difference or envi…

Here is a very interesting review article discussing genetics and its unproven role in East Africans' ability to win marathons: http://www.fims.org/default.asp?pageID=782860264

Re: NFL player IQ by position

#64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(I noticed all of the comments you contributed to this community are effectively unsubstantiated racism. I suspect I am wasting my time replying, so I will keep this brief.) "foot speed and intelligence are inversely correlated...'[black people are faster and dumber and white people are slower and smarter]'" You are missing the point entirely. While there is an inverse correlation between footspeed and intelligence i…

The existence of a racial gap in IQ is simply not in dispute. It shows up in SAT scores, it shows up in military IQ tests during times with a draft, and it shows up in numerous psychological studies. See for instance this paper from Brookings Institute, which is about as mainstream liberal as you can get ( http://www.brookings.edu/views/papers/dickens/20060619_iq.pd... ) The only question is if the difference or envi…

FYI, I specially created this account to post on this thread, because I was scared of being called a racist and didn't want that tarnishing my normal account.

I think it is funny that you talk about how we "should not be scared of things 'you can't say" and about how we should "try to get an accurate view of reality" when you have basically created a sockpuppet to post this. If you really believe these things and think rational discussion about them is important, you should be using your normal account.

Re: NFL player IQ by position

#65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(I noticed all of the comments you contributed to this community are effectively unsubstantiated racism. I suspect I am wasting my time replying, so I will keep this brief.) "foot speed and intelligence are inversely correlated...'[black people are faster and dumber and white people are slower and smarter]'" You are missing the point entirely. While there is an inverse correlation between footspeed and intelligence i…

The existence of a racial gap in IQ is simply not in dispute. It shows up in SAT scores, it shows up in military IQ tests during times with a draft, and it shows up in numerous psychological studies. See for instance this paper from Brookings Institute, which is about as mainstream liberal as you can get ( http://www.brookings.edu/views/papers/dickens/20060619_iq.pd... ) The only question is if the difference or envi…

>Studies of IQ highly correlate with latitude. People of northern Chinese and Mongolian origin score higher than the Vietnamese. In limited studies, Intuits score higher than Native Americans from Central America. 60,000 years is actually quite a long time, and the skills necessary to survive harsh northern winters are very different than those needed to survive in tropical jungles.

Hpw about Ashkenazi Jews, whom have the highest IQ and yet do not originate from a high latitude?

Re: NFL player IQ by position

#66
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's an explanation for why foot speed and intelligence are inversely correlated: "Upper body strength is relatively equally distributed between the races, but footspeed most definitely is not. So, tailbacks, wide receivers, and defensive players have a need for speed, so they are disproportionately black. I haven't checked recently, but in most recent years since Jason Sehorn's retirement, none of the 64 NFL start…

You seem to be assuming that intelligence and IQ are the same thing. Is that what you meant? Just to be clear, I believe in speaking frankly about race, so am not objecting to that aspect of your post. But I'm skeptical of attempts to bottle up something as grand as "intelligence" into a single metric. For example, I read somewhere that the original Stanford-Binet had to be modified because women were scoring higher…

Intelligence is a grand notion indeed. Check out the notion of multiple intelligences

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory_of_multiple_intelligence...

IQ scores are useful for assessing mostly logical intelligence, and to some extent visual spatial intelligence.

Re: NFL player IQ by position

#67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(I noticed all of the comments you contributed to this community are effectively unsubstantiated racism. I suspect I am wasting my time replying, so I will keep this brief.) "foot speed and intelligence are inversely correlated...'[black people are faster and dumber and white people are slower and smarter]'" You are missing the point entirely. While there is an inverse correlation between footspeed and intelligence i…

The existence of a racial gap in IQ is simply not in dispute. It shows up in SAT scores, it shows up in military IQ tests during times with a draft, and it shows up in numerous psychological studies. See for instance this paper from Brookings Institute, which is about as mainstream liberal as you can get ( http://www.brookings.edu/views/papers/dickens/20060619_iq.pd... ) The only question is if the difference or envi…

I think you mean "Inuit" not "Intuit" ?

Re: NFL player IQ by position

#68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't like Gladwell's talk because he ignored baseball: teams like Oakland and Boston have started to understand what metrics do work in assessing player performance (Michael Lewis wrote about this in detail in " Moneyball "). By ignoring something because it doesn't fit in his neat theory, Gladwell loses credibility on this topic.

And every topic he writes about.

Yeah I have noticed that. Reading his stuff reminds me of junk food, kind of nice at the time but not long before either I want more, or regret having read it. I think its the journalist style writing that I find unsatisfying (his books are one of the few I end up leaving lying around, unfinished and never seem to want to pick up again).

Re: NFL player IQ by position

#69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(I noticed all of the comments you contributed to this community are effectively unsubstantiated racism. I suspect I am wasting my time replying, so I will keep this brief.) "foot speed and intelligence are inversely correlated...'[black people are faster and dumber and white people are slower and smarter]'" You are missing the point entirely. While there is an inverse correlation between footspeed and intelligence i…

The existence of a racial gap in IQ is simply not in dispute. It shows up in SAT scores, it shows up in military IQ tests during times with a draft, and it shows up in numerous psychological studies. See for instance this paper from Brookings Institute, which is about as mainstream liberal as you can get ( http://www.brookings.edu/views/papers/dickens/20060619_iq.pd... ) The only question is if the difference or envi…

A very small data set:

On my street, there were 8 black children. All 8 scored above 1200 on their SATs -- 5 of them scored 1500 or above, with one garnering perfect score. One (myself) scored a perfect score on the ASVAB (Military IQ test, as you put it -- I have not met anyone else, black or white, who has done this). Two to MIT, one to U Chicago, 5 to four-year public institution (although three of the five were accepted into Ivy League schools, and indeed offered scholarships).

Re: NFL player IQ by position

#70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(I noticed all of the comments you contributed to this community are effectively unsubstantiated racism. I suspect I am wasting my time replying, so I will keep this brief.) "foot speed and intelligence are inversely correlated...'[black people are faster and dumber and white people are slower and smarter]'" You are missing the point entirely. While there is an inverse correlation between footspeed and intelligence i…

The existence of a racial gap in IQ is simply not in dispute. It shows up in SAT scores, it shows up in military IQ tests during times with a draft, and it shows up in numerous psychological studies. See for instance this paper from Brookings Institute, which is about as mainstream liberal as you can get ( http://www.brookings.edu/views/papers/dickens/20060619_iq.pd... ) The only question is if the difference or envi…

I find your posts to be a bit over-generalizing and lacking of supporting evidence.

Examining the physiques of West Africans versus East Africans makes the genetic explanation pretty obvious.

What's obvious and could you share it with the rest of us?

From the article shared below (http://www.fims.org/default.asp?pageID=782860264):

"In a study of the demographic characteristics of elite Ethiopian athletes, 38% of the elite marathon runners were from the region of Arsi, which accounts for less than 5% of the Ethiopian population 2. As shown in Figure 1, these findings were mirrored in Kenya, where 81% of the best Kenyan runners originated from the Rift Valley province, which accounts for less than a quarter of the Kenyan population 1. "

"These initial studies of elite Kenyan athletes by Saltin et al. 6;14 demonstrate that factors such as increased childhood physical activity and hard training are probably the major contributors to the superior performances of Kenyan runners"

"The concept of ‘black’ athletic superiority is based on a preconception that each race constitutes a genetically homogeneous group, with race defined simply by skin colour. This belief is contrary to the assertion that there is more genetic variation among Africans than between African and Eurasian populations 24."

"interesting that Ethiopia and Kenya do not share a similar genetic ancestry, as defined by mtDNA 22;43, but what they do share is a similar environment: moderate altitude and high levels of physical activity. Few other regions of the world have such high levels of childhood physical activity combined with such cultural/financial importance being placed on distance running. This information clearly implicates environmental factors as being more influential than genetic factors in the success of East African distance runners. In an economically deprived region such as East Africa, economic factors also provide an additional motivation, if not a necessity, to succeed in distance running. In summary, it is unjustified at present to regard the phenomenon of East African running success as genetically mediated; to justify doing so one must identify the genes that are important. To do so also disregards the intense training regimens for which East African athletes are famous 56."

conclusion: not based on color of skin, nor based on genetics.

Post reply on HN