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Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

cabal.chat

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Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#281

Post by oftheoaks »

DeadReckoning wrote: post #269
ReactiveJelly wrote: post #128

Checked the FAQ. Downside: It doesn't support Tor and they don't seem to have any plan for that. So it's trusted-friends-only, IPs are always visible. Which is pointless for me, as a person trying to build healthy online friendships from behind Tor. Upside: I was afraid it's a reaction to Parler being deplatformed. And then I thought maybe it was a side-project of Urbit. But looking at the Values page: "No nazis, no…

Why would anyone care about using a p2p nonstandard messenger except for free speech? This app implies it will moderate certain groups. If you’re saying something uncontroversial you can just use a bigtech app.

I like cabal because I can read & write messages when I'm offline or there's no internet. It's also nice because I can start a private chat room for my friends without anyone needing to host and maintain any servers or infrastructure.

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#282

Post by generalizations »

kelnos wrote: post #273
generalizations wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there a difference? The reasons we hold our opinions are fundamentally just another set of opinions. Unless you're talking about something more fundamental - in that case, yes, we can still be friends when our first principles are opposed. It's just harder. I think it comes down to just how tolerant we're willing to be. It's easy to be tolerant when the stakes are low; who cares if someone is doing something somew…

> The Christian ideal is to be tolerant of someone who is actively doing us harm. That seems like a foolish ideal that has the end result of you being marginalized, with people who would do harm to you and others gaining control of society. Frankly, it sounds like just another system of control invented by religious leaders. People who actively do us harm should be swiftly and firmly disabused of the notion that what…

Tolerance doesn't mean you never resist. Tolerance means you're willing to have a conversation, and you can be friends in spite of fundamental differences.

Christians who live up to the ideal are willing to have a civil relationship with anyone. That's the point. That's tolerance.

It means you actually know the other person, and you're not making (possibly misinformed) assumptions about them. The next step in the relationship may very well be to 'firmly disabuse them', but it's not the first step.

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#283

Post by coldtea »

hackmiester wrote: post #256
userbinator wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This new trend in identity politics is more disturbing than anything the left or right has done.

I love the idea of a site that doesn't give Nazis a voice. This is apparently somehow a controversial idea. It is becoming exhausting.

>I love the idea of a site that doesn't give Nazis a voice. This is apparently somehow a controversial idea.

Given that actual Nazi's were a historical phenomenon that ended in 1945, and that bona fide neonazis are few and far between), this is code for:

"I love the idea of a site that doesn't give people I disagree with a voice. This is apparently somehow a controversial idea."

Yes. It always has been. Orwell called it even back in 1944 (where real Nazi's still existed):

"It will be seen that, as used, the word ‘Fascism’ is almost entirely meaningless. In conversation, of course, it is used even more wildly than in print. I have heard it applied to farmers, shopkeepers, Social Credit, corporal punishment, fox-hunting, bull-fighting, the 1922 Committee, the 1941 Committee, Kipling, Gandhi, Chiang Kai-Shek, homosexuality, Priestley's broadcasts, Youth Hostels, astrology, women, dogs and I do not know what else."

>It is becoming exhausting.

Tell me about it.

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#284

Post by coldtea »

korla wrote: post #274
Thorentis wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All Nazi books should be burnt since we don't want certain information existing in the world. I actually think rounding up all Nazis and putting them in labor camps might be okay. Heck, what about actually killing nazis? Is there some kind of political idealogy where taking these actions against minorities is supported and allowed?

Are you suggesting it is not in a society's interest to limit hate speech against minorities? Because that is what is being discussed.

Parent is probably suggesting that:

(a) what is "hate speech" is a vague term to be filled by whoever yields the power to define it (could be anything from talk against religion, to conservative worldviews, to class-war ideas, to racist beliefs, to complaints against politicians, and so on).

(b) what is a minority can also be vague and politically determined as opposed through raw numbers, and the power of a minority could be more than its size tells us (e.g. the 1% is a class-based minority, but most don't have an issue with going against them. Similarly, in certain cases it's one or more minorities that have the power against the majority - e.g. the fewer white-spanish descendants over indians and mulatos in some Latin American countries, or the white 20% against the blacks 80% in appartheid South Africa).

So, no, it's not clear cut that it's "in a society's interest to limit hate speech against minorities".

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#285

Post by deeviant »

monoideism wrote: post #261
deeviant wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't be so sure. Trump-Qanon supporters seem to be pretty common around here. They were very active in the "Trump banned from twitter" post. Doesn't surprise me as (Trump|QAnon)'ism seems to be very inviting to the tech bro culture.

If QAnon is truly "pretty common" on HN, then I'm sure you could easily point out, say, 3-4 QAnon posts on here from the past week. That should be easy if QAnon is common on HN, right?

I specifically said (Trump|QAnon). It's pretty hard to tell the average trump supporter apart from the average QAnon supporter.

And you could look at my comments and those who commented in return to find your 3-4 posters. That's pretty easy, right?

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#286

Post by anticensor »

amelius wrote: post #72
cpach wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Evolution will take care of that. A lot of them will simply fizzle out.

Sadly, evolution seems to not converge to a single chat standard.

It converges to XKCD 927 instead.

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#287

Post by [deleted] »

userbinator wrote: post #252
ReactiveJelly wrote: post #128

Checked the FAQ. Downside: It doesn't support Tor and they don't seem to have any plan for that. So it's trusted-friends-only, IPs are always visible. Which is pointless for me, as a person trying to build healthy online friendships from behind Tor. Upside: I was afraid it's a reaction to Parler being deplatformed. And then I thought maybe it was a side-project of Urbit. But looking at the Values page: "No nazis, no…

This new trend in identity politics is more disturbing than anything the left or right has done.

[deleted]

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#288

Post by supermatt »

jakswa wrote: post #38
supermatt wrote: post #35

How does peer discovery work? Im assuming there must be some central server(s) to handle the bootstrap? I had a quick scan through the github projects, but couldnt see any high level documentation explaining the architecture. Would appreciate some insight!

"Currently searches across and advertises on the Bittorrent DHT, centralized DNS servers and Multicast DNS simultaneously."

Oh yeah, I understand that bit - but how does it connect to the DHT in the first place. I couldnt see any information on where it connects when you arent yet peered (i.e. how does it bootstrap).

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#289

Post by Aeolun »

generalizations wrote: post #254
Aeolun wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t distance myself from people with a different opinion. I distance myself from people that have a different opinion for the wrong reasons.

Is there a difference? The reasons we hold our opinions are fundamentally just another set of opinions. Unless you're talking about something more fundamental - in that case, yes, we can still be friends when our first principles are opposed. It's just harder. I think it comes down to just how tolerant we're willing to be. It's easy to be tolerant when the stakes are low; who cares if someone is doing something somew…

> yes, we can still be friends when our first principles are opposed. It's just harder.

If someone tells me they think I’m fundamentally a lesser person than them because of skin color, just because that’s how god made us, that’s not a fruitful base for a good relationship.

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#290

Post by asdff »

coldtea wrote: post #283
hackmiester wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love the idea of a site that doesn't give Nazis a voice. This is apparently somehow a controversial idea. It is becoming exhausting.

> I love the idea of a site that doesn't give Nazis a voice. This is apparently somehow a controversial idea. Given that actual Nazi's were a historical phenomenon that ended in 1945, and that bona fide neonazis are few and far between), this is code for: "I love the idea of a site that doesn't give people I disagree with a voice. This is apparently somehow a controversial idea." Yes. It always has been. Orwell calle…

Oh come on. There was a rioter wearing a "Camp Auschwitz" sweatshirt in the Capitol this week. Nazis are very much still around and they were there in DC.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/08/world/europe/us-capitol-r...

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