Twitter suspends Trump's campaign account TeamTrump for violating its rules • Hacker News Board

Re: Twitter suspends Trump's campaign account TeamTrump for violating its rules

#281

Post by collyw » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 4:16 PM UTC

colejohnson66 wrote: post #258

cmroanirgo wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> DT's time in power was up Isn't his time up on Jan 20? It really looks like collusion to this Aussie (me), who has no stake in the game. > while it makes good PR. I'm sure there's quite a few million Trump voters who would disagree it's good PR. As mercurial as he's been, he is still the sitting president of the country which lauds itself as the greatest (personally I disagree with the latter assessment). So, what…

> Isn't his time up on Jan 20? It really looks like collusion to this Aussie (me), who has no stake in the game. Jumping on a bandwagon isn’t collusion. Twitter started by fact checking him back in November. Other sites followed. Over time, Twitter got more aggressive about it before banning him. Now everyone else isn’t the first to ban, so it’s not as “scary” to do so. It took as long as it did because no one wanted…

>Twitter started by fact checking him back in November.

"This claim is disputed", yet the Flat Earth Societies page remained unchallenged. It's clearly political bias more than a search for the truth.

Re: Twitter suspends Trump's campaign account TeamTrump for violating its rules

#282

Post by web007 » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 5:22 PM UTC

apta_ wrote: post #262

web007 wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trump being deplatformed from Twitter is long, long overdue. They had to rewrite their content policies to give him a loophole a long time ago, since any normal person would be banned for what he said. They recently started having to add disclaimers, because even the loophole wasn't enough to counter his wrongness and influence.

Why don't they ban people like https://cdn.cnsnews.com/styles/article_big/s3/2021-01/Arthur...

I don't know why they don't. They should.

Re: Twitter suspends Trump's campaign account TeamTrump for violating its rules

#283

Post by collyw » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 5:30 PM UTC

DonHopkins wrote: post #104

kristofferR wrote: post #83

The storming of the Capitol was another 9/11 type of event, we are now in the same climate that lead to the Patriot Act, war, torture and countless other abuses. People are cheering on the bans without thinking further of the massive negative consequences this slippery slope will likely lead to. Glenn Greenwald did an excellent interview yesterday where he explained exactly why acting hastily after traumatic events a…

The 9/11 event was Trump being president during the Corona virus pandemic. His incompetence has been killing more people every day than the number of people killed on 9/11, for quite some time now.

Out of interest what do you actually expect him to have done regarding covid?

He wanted to ban flights from CHina but that was shouted down as being racist.

We have had all sorts of nonsense restrictions here in Europe, masks have been mandatory for months and they don't seem to have made a noticeable difference (case numbers keep going up, so restrictions are made tighter, but nothing changes).

A number of vaccines have been created in record time (not sure Trump had a great deal to do with that but he certainly didn't hinder it).

So what in your opinion should Trump have done?

Re: Twitter suspends Trump's campaign account TeamTrump for violating its rules

#284

Post by collyw » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 5:34 PM UTC

hmottestad wrote: post #252

ethbr0 wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 9/11 takeaway is that we should be especially skeptic of making large policy decisions and/or restricting civil liberties after an emotional event, because it's usually an overcorrection that goes unredressed for the next two decades.

Which means that if we choose to ignore the Trump aspect of the corona virus and compare the US to other countries you get the following: - no free healthcare means you initially had to pay to get tested - underdeveloped healthcare system (initial wave saw NYC overwhelmed) - lack of labor laws means that you have few rights: no sick days and can easily be fired with no grace period - polarized political environment m…

We have a rather good state run healthcare system where I am and we also had the first two problems you describe.

- You can't get free tests easily. - almost overwhelmed hospitals - pretty much at their limit.

We have pretty much the same % deaths as the US - 0.1% of the population, so less than Heart disease or cancer, but worse than an average flu.

Re: Twitter suspends Trump's campaign account TeamTrump for violating its rules

#285

Post by collyw » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 5:39 PM UTC

iron0013 wrote: post #201

kypro wrote: post #172

Remember when people said "it's only extremists like Alex Jones" and "white nationalists", yeah well now Twitter has banned the president of the United States. I'm not a supporter of Trump, but I'm yet to hear him explicitly incite violence. I know he encouraged the protest at the Capitol but I've yet to see evidence that he was hoping for it to turn violent? And if he did want that why did he speak out against it? H…

>Remember when people said "it's only extremists like Alex Jones" and "white nationalists", yeah well now Twitter has banned the president of the United States. The president of the United States is in fact an extremist like Alex Jones and a white nationalist.

> The president of the United States is in fact an extremist like Alex Jones and a white nationalist.

This sounds like a comment from Reddit. From an outsider perceptive (European) he seems neither an extremist nor a white nationalist. He is a nationalist for sure, but I have never heard Trump talk about people grouping them by skin colour, unlike Obama. I have only heard Trump talk about "Americans" and he divides that into the left or right.

Re: Twitter suspends Trump's campaign account TeamTrump for violating its rules

#286

Post by craftinator » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 6:07 PM UTC

ethbr0 wrote: post #280

craftinator wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> New York City was not overwhelmed in the first wave, and had both Javits and the Mercy as unused spare capacity. This is not in line with the facts as I understand them. Multiple health care workers I know told me in March-April that their ability to treat Covid patients were capped by constrained resources (not enough ventilators, not enough staff, not enough beds) during the first wave. Here [1] is an article tha…

I don't think [1] suppports that. That's a report from a single hospital. > [...] the ICU is at capacity, patient beds line the hallways of the emergency department, and the morgue is overflowing. [...] has a capacity of about 300 people at any given time They then talk about converting elective space and hallways into bed space. Which was pretty normal everywhere. And critically, NYC, as with all major metros, opera…

> I don't think [1] suppports that. That's a report from a single hospital.

> And critically, NYC, as with all major metros, operates as a system of hospitals. So the data to support your assertion would be total NYC bed & ICU bed capacity & utilization.

> "Overwhelmed" means unable to provide care.

Yes, and about half of [2] comes from Michael Dowling, the head of the largest hospital system in New York, where he goes on at length about patients dying in hallways having never been treated because they didn't have enough staff, ventilators, bed space etc... Did you not read the articles?

> The situation on the Comfort in NYC (swapped my coasts, oops!) was... complicated. The Navy was essentially commanded to "Send a big ship to NYC so it can be seen."

This has nothing to do with how overrun NYC hospitals from, nor how effective the Navy hospital ships were at helping ease the burden.

And right back at ya: Please see guidelines for HN commenting. Specifically, "Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Twitter suspends Trump's campaign account TeamTrump for violating its rules

#287

Post by ethbr0 » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 8:28 PM UTC

craftinator wrote: post #286

ethbr0 wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think [1] suppports that. That's a report from a single hospital. > [...] the ICU is at capacity, patient beds line the hallways of the emergency department, and the morgue is overflowing. [...] has a capacity of about 300 people at any given time They then talk about converting elective space and hallways into bed space. Which was pretty normal everywhere. And critically, NYC, as with all major metros, opera…

> I don't think [1] suppports that. That's a report from a single hospital. > And critically, NYC, as with all major metros, operates as a system of hospitals. So the data to support your assertion would be total NYC bed & ICU bed capacity & utilization. > "Overwhelmed" means unable to provide care. Yes, and about half of [2] comes from Michael Dowling, the head of the largest hospital system in New York, where he go…

You managed to ignore two other guidelines in one comment, so it's probably not productive for either of us to continue this thread.

Re: Twitter suspends Trump's campaign account TeamTrump for violating its rules

#288

Post by ethbr0 » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 8:36 PM UTC

collyw wrote: post #284

hmottestad wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which means that if we choose to ignore the Trump aspect of the corona virus and compare the US to other countries you get the following: - no free healthcare means you initially had to pay to get tested - underdeveloped healthcare system (initial wave saw NYC overwhelmed) - lack of labor laws means that you have few rights: no sick days and can easily be fired with no grace period - polarized political environment m…

We have a rather good state run healthcare system where I am and we also had the first two problems you describe. - You can't get free tests easily. - almost overwhelmed hospitals - pretty much at their limit. We have pretty much the same % deaths as the US - 0.1% of the population, so less than Heart disease or cancer, but worse than an average flu.

One thing that disappoints me most about the entire response is the shifting narrative.

I'm in a technical field. I understand the fits and starts and retractions that constitute actual scientific process.

But my understanding from reading earlier governmental / military pandemic wargames is that there was one overriding discovery: never hide or obscure the truth, as once public trust is lost it can never be regained.

This was always participants' original sin, and again and again it failed. You need public participation and adherence, and you can't do that without their trust.

So in scenarios where you have limited test kits available, don't tell people they don't need to get tested. Tell them the scenarios they should get tested in, on Day 1, and then explain that there's a shortage of tests, who they're currently going to, and what you're doing to increase the supply.

A vacuum of information creates panic. Trustworthiness, even in dire circumstances, creates shared goals.

(PS: I'm painfully aware the US president was leading most of this, but prefer to treat that situation like the racist uncle at Thanksgiving. Roll your eyes, dig a steak knife into your own leg, ignore what he said, and get on with the business of talking to other adults)

Re: Twitter suspends Trump's campaign account TeamTrump for violating its rules

#289

Post by deathlight » Mon, Jan 11, 2021, 4:10 AM UTC

leptoniscool wrote: post #72

The First Amendment applies ONLY to the government: Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. There's no legal reason a private company cannot manage its content?

Surely there is a stronger defense of these companies' actions besides them being not prohibited by law.

Re: Twitter suspends Trump's campaign account TeamTrump for violating its rules

#290

Post by craftinator » Mon, Jan 11, 2021, 4:42 PM UTC

ethbr0 wrote: post #287

craftinator wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't think [1] suppports that. That's a report from a single hospital. > And critically, NYC, as with all major metros, operates as a system of hospitals. So the data to support your assertion would be total NYC bed & ICU bed capacity & utilization. > "Overwhelmed" means unable to provide care. Yes, and about half of [2] comes from Michael Dowling, the head of the largest hospital system in New York, where he go…

You managed to ignore two other guidelines in one comment, so it's probably not productive for either of us to continue this thread.

Ah, which ones? Please, if you'd like to argue a point which I made referencing an article, please actually read the article.