Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store • Hacker News Board

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#501

Post by kortilla » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 1:44 AM UTC

JMTQp8lwXL wrote: post #267

djsumdog wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The purge has been happening for years. I hate how people on HN is praising this. There are literally few alternatives for the average person apart from Google and eyeProducts. I have a PinePhone, but what percentage of America can truly put in the effort to use one? If you cannot install an run your own software on a device, you do not own the device. You cannot praise the removal of Gab or Parlor now and complain l…

How can the bans (being de-platformed) be more horrific than the actual violence that's occurred?

Well you get to suppress any speech that is too disruptive to the status quo, which includes all of the horrific things the government does.

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#502

Post by quickthrowman » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 1:44 AM UTC

blisterpeanuts wrote: post #258

jackson1442 wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did the BLM riots promote sedition? That's probably why. Also worth noting that there was no property damage or injuries in more than 97 to 98% of protests[1] [1]: https://today.uconn.edu/2020/10/study-2020-protests-shows-di...

Wherein 100 people spilling over a barrier into a government building (and one of them getting shot to death) is somehow worse than the aforementioned billions in property damage and assaults on cops, smashed police cars, passersby attacked, stores looted, fires set... in 12 different cities around the nation?

For some historical perspective, the last time the Capitol was stormed, British soldiers burned it to the ground. This was 200 years ago.

There have been multiple riots over multiple police-involved killings in multiple locations in the last decade.

So yes, what they did was far worse. They claimed to be defending the constitution while in fact they were using force to stop a constitutionally-mandated process: certifying the electoral vote. They were incited to do this by the President of the United States. None of this has ever happened before in America.

Over the summer, 8 men were arrested for plotting to kidnap the Governor of Michigan. There were multiple people with zip tie handcuffs in their possession in the Capitol. What do you think their aims were?

Open your eyes and see how truly insane Wednesday was, please.

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#503

Post by PHGamer » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 1:44 AM UTC

JMTQp8lwXL wrote: post #397

Andrew_nenakhov wrote: post #381

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Easy. Tech giants have means to control all public speech and information exchange. -> they ally with political party -> ensure they win elections, fairly or whatever, no one will be able to tell the story that votes are counted unfairly -> install an unremovable authoritarian dictatorship. Which might have imitation elections & stuff, just like USSR had. And then, 'correction' camps for people that do not fully fit…

How much insurrection is acceptable before the tradeoff of a 'new beautiful society' is the better deal? Both sound like bad outcomes. Neither sounds obviously superior.

the insurrection is the political classes fault! if they hadnt shown the right that they were ok with burning cities the right wouldnt have had enough and actually did something. Sure the political class is going to make examples because this wasnt approved like the other but now their own words are getting thrown at them. granted a civil war will make the soviet collapse look like a cakewalk so im not preaching for that but holy damn. and it doesnt help this censorship means 40% of the country will think there is indeed a conspiracy now and will cause more unrest which will cause more more tyranny which will cause more unrest which causes a giant feedback loop. the higher ups literally are meeting their destiny by trying to avoid it. this could very well not end well.

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#504

Post by FDSGSG » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 1:44 AM UTC

SpaceRaccoon wrote: post #485

valuearb wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you must have a native mobile app, you can download it from alternative stores. Or Parlour can just distribute as a web app. Businesses don’t have any right to force other businesses to carry their products.

> Or Parlour can just distribute as a web app. Okay. Then hosting providers refuse to host. Payment processors refuse to process your payments for web services. Your domains are revoked. Your SSL certs are revoked. Where does this end? If they have the power to, and they've justified it this far, why wouldn't they keep going?

If nobody wants to do business with you, maybe you are the problem?

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#505

Post by valuearb » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 1:44 AM UTC

johndevor wrote: post #364

rrose wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I seriously can't identify with this viewpoint. There's no censorship here- parler still exists, people are still free to share their (abhorrent) viewpoints there, Google is just choosing not to amplify the voices of people that have proven themselves capable of and prone to violence. All the pearl-clutching over free speech is totally overblown.

Sure, people technically have free speech. But not in any meaningful sense. It's like trying to have a debate when the other side has a megaphone.

It only feels like a megaphone when most people disagree with you. And the web is the real megaphone, and it’s still unlimited.

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#506

Post by Izkata » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 1:44 AM UTC

sirius87 wrote: post #449

PurpleFoxy wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a big point. I feel it’s acceptable for google to remove whatever they want because android allows you to install the apk directly. IMO apple should either be forced to allow side loading apps or to accept everything within reason to the App Store.

And if installation of apks from unknown sources goes away because some nasty malware exploits it or other security excuse becomes available? Hard not to be alarmed by the pattern here.

Samsung does (or at least did) lock down their Android phones like that. They had to be rooted to get third-party APKs installed.

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#507

Post by sillycon-valley » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 1:44 AM UTC

betenoire wrote: post #496

sillycon-valley wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah you can think in the corner and noone will hear you like you don't exist. It's about having a voice. It's about the main argument being "it's a private company" then going and banning the alternatives.

I don't have a right to be heard, that's not what free speech is. I also don't have the right to insist on other people publishing my views for me (corporations are people now, remember). And I certainly don't need to feel validated by apps.

Ah yes I forgot how pro-Apple, pro-Monopoly, pro-Corporate Hacker News was.

Like it or not social media platforms are the new town square. Yes the current censorship is legal, it doesn't make it right.

Especially when people make their own app then get banished on the only two app store monopolies.

I believe there's already some anti-trust issues there. Epic made a 1984 ad about Apple.

The sentiment here is generally Apple is a monopoly, today is different.

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#508

Post by matz1 » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 1:44 AM UTC

guscost wrote: post #457

matz1 wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is always subjective, the entity in power get to decide the rule, in this case google is the entity in power. Its not enough to have rule that says 'illegal content not allowed', in the case of play store it has to be 'illegal content (according to google) not allowed'

Surely there must be a way to let the courts determine legality in every single controversial case. It’s just an optimization problem. We sent fourteen people to walk around on the moon, twelve of them made it, and all of them made it back.

As long as that way, whatever it is, still involve more than one human, you can't avoid the subjectivity problem.

Its not technology problem. Its human problem.

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#509

Post by lenkite » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 1:45 AM UTC

JMTQp8lwXL wrote: post #267

djsumdog wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The purge has been happening for years. I hate how people on HN is praising this. There are literally few alternatives for the average person apart from Google and eyeProducts. I have a PinePhone, but what percentage of America can truly put in the effort to use one? If you cannot install an run your own software on a device, you do not own the device. You cannot praise the removal of Gab or Parlor now and complain l…

How can the bans (being de-platformed) be more horrific than the actual violence that's occurred?

Why is violence from one side celebrated and called "peaceful" ?

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#510

Post by throwawaysea » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 1:45 AM UTC

modriano wrote: post #446

djsumdog wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The purge has been happening for years. I hate how people on HN is praising this. There are literally few alternatives for the average person apart from Google and eyeProducts. I have a PinePhone, but what percentage of America can truly put in the effort to use one? If you cannot install an run your own software on a device, you do not own the device. You cannot praise the removal of Gab or Parlor now and complain l…

Are you at all worried about the possibility that America could have another civil war because a sufficiently large proportion of Americans are radicalized in uncensored, insufficiently moderated communities? Facebook's own research found “64% of all extremist group joins are due to our recommendation tools” and that most of the activity came from the platform’s “Groups You Should Join” and “Discover” algorithms: “Ou…

Why do you think there was a seditious conspiracy? Do you really honestly believe that a few hundred people marching onto the capitol have the ability to destabilize the country? Remember, we have layers upon layers of armed forces that would end any such attempt very very easily. I think this incident was more realistically just a bunch of amped up protesters who got caught up in the moment and crossed a physical barrier, but had no greater ambition of taking over the US government.

Not to mention, this is not the first time rioters have taken over capitol hill while Congress has gathered. It has happened over and over many times, even in the past few years. Which of the following events did you see broad front-page coverage of, along with censorship/deplatforming on social media, and calls for resignation/expulsion of politicians:

Was it the capitol riot that AOC directly participated in (https://theintercept.com/2018/11/13/alexandria-ocasio-cortez...)? Perhaps it was the repeated incidents after AOC and Rashida Tlaib both encouraged this group to continue illegal rioting (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunrise_Movement)? Or the several past Capitol Hill riots staged by Democracy Spring (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Spring)? Or perhaps the Obamacare riots (https://www.cnn.com/2017/07/10/politics/health-care-protests...)? Or maybe when 600 people raided capitol hill to protest immigration law (https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/womens-march-protesters-call...)?

The reality is none of them resulted in any consequences for the activists, affiliated politicians, or organizations that either organized/led/incited those riots. After all, AOC is still here on Twitter/Instagram/whatever. The same thing happened throughout 2020. Rose City Antifa (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rose_City_Antifa) organized numerous highly violent riots at federal buildings in Portland - guess what, their Twitter account (https://twitter.com/RoseCityAntifa) still stands. BLM-affiliated events have caused billions in damage, and resulted in a far greater number of deaths - shouldn't they be deplatformed as well?

The tech companies making these changes at the eleventh hour is simply them pandering to the incoming administration (their new masters) and them finally caving in to their own political biases and putting their immense, unchecked power to use by attacking and suppressing their political enemies. It's a dark, dark day and like in all such catastrophes, it'll be welcomed with open arms.