Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Texas Instruments sent a DMCA takedown to a site archiving data sheets

twitter.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 124 posts

Re: Texas Instruments sent a DMCA takedown to a site archiving data sheets

#61

Post by FpUser »

canofbars wrote: post #20
blowfish721 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could it be a legacy culture thing? If you’ve ever dealt with traditional broadcast vendors it’s the same thing there, impossible to get even basic documentation and manuals without having an authorized account in most cases. Really is frustrating when you try to shop around for a new setup and all you can get is marketing material.

Most likely. The open source movement in software was still relatively recently and quite radical. The hardware companies are still stuck way in the past.

>"The hardware companies are still stuck way in the past."

Example: in the past my friend bought Moog Prodigy synthesizer and along with everything it also came with all the electronic circuitry diagrams. Good luck finding anything like this with the modern hardware.

Re: Texas Instruments sent a DMCA takedown to a site archiving data sheets

#62

Post by inetknght »

ryukafalz wrote: post #55
cushychicken wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's hard not to view this sort of stuff as saber rattling (or, more accurately, whining) from the OSHW community. TI is more than happy to work with you on their most cutting edge designs if you're shipping in appreciable volume. Talking a quarter million chips or more per year. That's just the way the wind blows in their business. Gotta recoup as much R&D expenditure as possible up front. I've worked with them on t…

I can understand hardware vendors not actively working with you on designs unless you're buying in volume. That's fine, they're a business, they have to make money and not lose money. What I don't understand about the hardware industry is the extent to which they actively restrict access to information on how their product works unless you're buying in volume. Why is it necessary to have layers of NDAs on a product d…

> I can understand hardware vendors not actively working with you on designs unless you're buying in volume.

I also understand. But in some ways I disagree: set a higher price instead. Let me, the customer, decide if the price is too high.

Re: Texas Instruments sent a DMCA takedown to a site archiving data sheets

#63

Post by spaetzleesser »

ryukafalz wrote: post #55
cushychicken wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's hard not to view this sort of stuff as saber rattling (or, more accurately, whining) from the OSHW community. TI is more than happy to work with you on their most cutting edge designs if you're shipping in appreciable volume. Talking a quarter million chips or more per year. That's just the way the wind blows in their business. Gotta recoup as much R&D expenditure as possible up front. I've worked with them on t…

I can understand hardware vendors not actively working with you on designs unless you're buying in volume. That's fine, they're a business, they have to make money and not lose money. What I don't understand about the hardware industry is the extent to which they actively restrict access to information on how their product works unless you're buying in volume. Why is it necessary to have layers of NDAs on a product d…

That’s always weird to me. Other companies do the same by hiding specs and documentation from people who aren’t paying big money. I always thought it was supposed to be better to spread your information as widely as possible so people can familiarize themselves with your product resulting in potential future sales.

Re: Texas Instruments sent a DMCA takedown to a site archiving data sheets

#64

Post by BostonEnginerd »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #4
mjevans wrote: post #2

Using copyright tools to try to contain published documentation of facts about anything is roughly where, if possible, I boycott anything involved with that company to the maximum reasonable extent. It is clear that TI no longer has an interest in developing new products, or figuring out better ways of making existing products, and would instead like to rent-seek and make the world a smaller place.

That was clear when Nokia fell and took down TI's OMAP processors with them and they just gave up to Quallcomm's Snapdragon without even putting up a fight. TI is now just rentseeking on their ananlog dominance and whatever sinking boat Intel is, TI is way worse.

They made a conscious decision to focus their efforts on where they're able to be a leader. They saw early on that they couldn't compete in advanced logic with the Asian foundries without making astronomical investments -- so they decided to compete in a non-feature size dominated market.

Re: Texas Instruments sent a DMCA takedown to a site archiving data sheets

#65

Post by spaetzleesser »

canofbars wrote: post #20
blowfish721 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could it be a legacy culture thing? If you’ve ever dealt with traditional broadcast vendors it’s the same thing there, impossible to get even basic documentation and manuals without having an authorized account in most cases. Really is frustrating when you try to shop around for a new setup and all you can get is marketing material.

Most likely. The open source movement in software was still relatively recently and quite radical. The hardware companies are still stuck way in the past.

“The hardware companies are still stuck way in the past.”

You wish they were stuck in the past. People like Steve Wozniak often designed new stuff only based on the manuals that back then had complete schematics in them. They didn’t have enough money first to buy anything but that information later on resulted in sales.

Re: Texas Instruments sent a DMCA takedown to a site archiving data sheets

#66

Post by suifbwish »

Mizza wrote: post #29

I once got a DMCA takedown request (well, Wikipedia did because of my edit) from Texas Instruments for the following numbers: p = B709D3A0CD2FEC08EAFCCF540D8A100BB38E5E091D646ADB7B14D021096FFCD q = B7207BD184E0B5A0B89832AA68849B29EDFB03FBA2E8917B176504F08A96246CB d = 4D0534BA8BB2BFA0740BFB6562E843C7EC7A58AE351CE11D43438CA239DD9927 6CD125FEBAEE5D2696579FA3A3958FF4FC54C685EAA91723BC8888F292947BA1 which can be used to s…

Just wait till GAN neural networks are more wide spread and refined. Is someone liable for copyright violation if their GAN neural network was trained on copyrighted images? The a refined version of the resulting GAN model can be used in reverse to generate false convincing variations of the original copyrighted media. Is anyone liable?

Re: Texas Instruments sent a DMCA takedown to a site archiving data sheets

#67

Post by neya »

rpaddock wrote: post #47
neya wrote: post #22

Cool, I was just going to use a TPA series amplifier for my commercial design this year. I'm just going to switch to ST Microelectronics which is what Bose et al use anyway. Good riddance. If you are stupid enough to DMCA 555 timer datasheets, you just shot yourself in the foot.

Being located in France ST is having a lot of personal issues right now. Lots of ST parts are getting hard to get so make sure you can get it. The ones you can get are going up in price.

Thank you, that's very useful to know.

Re: Texas Instruments sent a DMCA takedown to a site archiving data sheets

#68

Post by supermatt »

Its not even that TI are asking to de-index data sheets - they are asking to deindex TI products from 3rd party stores.

For example, DMCA notice: https://www.lumendatabase.org/notices/18049758?access_token=...

First link from "ALLEGEDLY INFRINGING URLS": https://www.distrelec.de/en/multivibrator-monostable-pdip-te...

They are pretty much all the same - product links. Did google simply obey this and delist the URLs? How is this even legal.

TI recently dropped some distributers - maybe they are doing this as a way of removing 3rd party retailers under guise of copyright violations - DMCA abuse, pure and simple. Should be HEAVY penalties for this kind of crap.

Re: Texas Instruments sent a DMCA takedown to a site archiving data sheets

#69

Post by diggan »

FpUser wrote: post #61
canofbars wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most likely. The open source movement in software was still relatively recently and quite radical. The hardware companies are still stuck way in the past.

>"The hardware companies are still stuck way in the past." Example: in the past my friend bought Moog Prodigy synthesizer and along with everything it also came with all the electronic circuitry diagrams. Good luck finding anything like this with the modern hardware.

It's the same today I think. Recently bought a Moog Sirin (released in 2019, compared to Prodigy that was released in 1979[?]) that also comes with a circuit diagram. Couple of other synths I own does the same.

Re: Texas Instruments sent a DMCA takedown to a site archiving data sheets

#70

Post by monocasa »

suifbwish wrote: post #66
Mizza wrote: post #29

I once got a DMCA takedown request (well, Wikipedia did because of my edit) from Texas Instruments for the following numbers: p = B709D3A0CD2FEC08EAFCCF540D8A100BB38E5E091D646ADB7B14D021096FFCD q = B7207BD184E0B5A0B89832AA68849B29EDFB03FBA2E8917B176504F08A96246CB d = 4D0534BA8BB2BFA0740BFB6562E843C7EC7A58AE351CE11D43438CA239DD9927 6CD125FEBAEE5D2696579FA3A3958FF4FC54C685EAA91723BC8888F292947BA1 which can be used to s…

Just wait till GAN neural networks are more wide spread and refined. Is someone liable for copyright violation if their GAN neural network was trained on copyrighted images? The a refined version of the resulting GAN model can be used in reverse to generate false convincing variations of the original copyrighted media. Is anyone liable?

I hope it doesn't turn out like patents, where everyone is infringing and there's a huge pressure to own "defensive" bodies of works.

In this context I can see that being another pressure which assures that large models are only able to be built by FAANG style companies.

Post reply on HN