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U.S. Capitol Locked Down Amid Escalating Protests

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Re: U.S. Capitol Locked Down Amid Escalating Protests

#751

Post by simonh »

gameswithgo wrote: post #494
coryfklein wrote: post #353

It's the practical erosion of Free Speech. Liberal (small "l" liberal) democracy and liberal science thrives on members: 1. Being willing to admit they may be wrong 2. Having access to a diverse information diet But the past two decades have shown erosion of not only legal Free Speech, but practical free speech: * Whereas previously they were just ignored (or even rebutted), today employees, students, and professors…

I see things almost completely opposite to you. Twenty years ago we had far less diverse access to information. You would get things from your local newspaper, or tv networks. Professionals would work and filter what we see. Today anyone can fire up a blog, twitter, youtube, and start talking about anything. People today thus have been getting exposed to all kinds of ideas, and being taken in by them: the earth is fl…

I think there’s a difference between diverse information being available, and people actually being exposed yo diverse viewpoints. With engagement driven social media more people than ever have a voice, but individuals are also fed a custom tuned diet of only a narrow range of views.

If you go looking for different opinions you can find them, but most people don’t do that. They let an algorithm generate their opinions for them by excluding anything that might challenge their views from their feed.

Re: U.S. Capitol Locked Down Amid Escalating Protests

#752

Post by anigbrowl »

smoyer wrote: post #446
umvi wrote: post #72

How did we arrive to this point where a huge chunk of the population is in one reality and another huge chunk of the population is in another reality? Segregation of information sources? Politicization of media outlets? Self-reinforcing social bubbles? A combination of all of them and more?

I think that one facet is implied by Dang's post above ... if we're not careful to have a respectful debate, then we'll end up having a shouting match instead. I used to appreciate grid-lock in DC under the idea that the less they got done, the less they'd do to me. Now I recognize that the best outcomes are a) when the lawmakers reach across the aisle and forge what both sides would consider a compromise and more im…

if we're not careful to have a respectful debate

This is misguided. Respectful debate in general is good, but only when both sides act in good faith. When some act in bad faith, telling outright lies while maintaining a veneer of civility, then you don't have obvious conflict but arguably something worse: corruption. There is some research showing that angry exchanges are in fact helpful in maintaining the integrity of an online community when others are trying to subvert it: https://snap.stanford.edu/conflict/

Re: U.S. Capitol Locked Down Amid Escalating Protests

#753

Post by mleonhard »

meowkit wrote: post #674
JosephHatfield wrote: post #625

Capital Police opened the security line, encouraged the "protesters" inside, and were even shown having selfies taken with them. What other conclusion can you reach than that this was supported if not organized by someone with authority over the security forces sworn to protect the Capital? If true, this is Sedition.

Its not true please don’t parrot nonsense. The cops were relatively gentle compared with the summer protests, but they didn’t just let people inside. Here is a livestream of the initial run on the steps: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_dGyEhnhGdw&feature=youtu.be

At what time point in the video do you see the protesters break through the police line? I scanned through the 1.5 hour video and didn't find it. It seems like the whole video was filmed from the same location.

Re: U.S. Capitol Locked Down Amid Escalating Protests

#754

Post by anigbrowl »

samch wrote: post #528

I think, for the safety of all involved, it may be time to enact section 4 of the 25th Amendment. Amendment 25 - Section 4: Whenever the Vice President and a majority of either the principal officers of the executive departments or of such other body as Congress may by law provide, transmit to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives their written declaration that the Pr…

Good luck finding half the cabinet willing to paint a target on their backs for every furious Trump supporter with a gun.

Re: U.S. Capitol Locked Down Amid Escalating Protests

#755

Post by 8note »

slumdev wrote: post #468
dhruvkar wrote: post #47

Are there people here on HN that believe the election was stolen? I haven't seen any evidence, most of the lawsuits haven't borne fruit either. However, I also recognize that there may be blindspots/biases. I'd really like to hear from anyone who believes this, to present a cogent argument. I promise not to attack. I want to hear the argument from the other side. I also beseech the rest of HN to please refrain from a…

Fraud occurred. That much is tautological. A single instance of a dead person voting proves the statement true. To say, "fraud didn't occur," is an outright lie. The debate is over (1) how much fraud occurred and (2) whether it affected the results. Someone else posted the "Here is the Evidence" link. Too many videos of (R) election judges being denied access to counts done in secret, organizers paying for votes, pos…

You cannot say whether it's fraud in favour of trump or in favour of Biden though.

You can consider that the republicans in California set up fake drop off centers so they could throw out votes, and that voter laws are made with the intention of suppressing voters. Things like managers not letting their employees leave work to go vote is voter fraud

Re: U.S. Capitol Locked Down Amid Escalating Protests

#756

Post by [deleted] »

umvi wrote: post #72

How did we arrive to this point where a huge chunk of the population is in one reality and another huge chunk of the population is in another reality? Segregation of information sources? Politicization of media outlets? Self-reinforcing social bubbles? A combination of all of them and more?

[deleted]

Re: U.S. Capitol Locked Down Amid Escalating Protests

#757

Post by [deleted] »

codingprograms wrote: post #84
umvi wrote: post #72

How did we arrive to this point where a huge chunk of the population is in one reality and another huge chunk of the population is in another reality? Segregation of information sources? Politicization of media outlets? Self-reinforcing social bubbles? A combination of all of them and more?

Nobody trusts the media. So people will believe what they want. There’s no source of truth

[deleted]

Re: U.S. Capitol Locked Down Amid Escalating Protests

#759

Post by zamadatix »

brightball wrote: post #479
coryfklein wrote: post #353

It's the practical erosion of Free Speech. Liberal (small "l" liberal) democracy and liberal science thrives on members: 1. Being willing to admit they may be wrong 2. Having access to a diverse information diet But the past two decades have shown erosion of not only legal Free Speech, but practical free speech: * Whereas previously they were just ignored (or even rebutted), today employees, students, and professors…

The biggest thing that I’ve seen in the news haven’t come from lies but from removal of context. Anything can be made more inflammatory if you remove key details while still remaining factually correct. - Tim punched Bob - Bob punched Tim - Bob and Tim shake hands Reported as... - Bob punched Tim Factually correct but lacking context. Unless the reader knows the entire story be putting it together from multiple repor…

https://www.allsides.com/unbiased-balanced-news is based around your closing statement. I make no claim about how well they do it, I just know they exist.

Re: U.S. Capitol Locked Down Amid Escalating Protests

#760

Post by ASinclair »

OCASM wrote: post #549
shadowfacts wrote: post #40

It is despicable how tepid the police response to armed rioters storming the Capitol has been compared to the response to BLM protests over the summer.

Were they destroying property and throwing molotov cocktails at them like Antifa/BLM did over the summer?

Yes. They were smashing windows and doors in the Capitol. They destroyed press cameras and other recording equipment. I didn't see any reports of molotov cocktails explicitly but they were using pepper spray and other similar sprays against the police.
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