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Amazon buys 11 Boeing 767s to expand its cargo fleet

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Re: Amazon buys 11 Boeing 767s to expand its cargo fleet

#161
post #16
post #11

I remember watching a video from Wendover Production talking about the decline of 747 and A380s mainly due to a lack of guaranteed passengers to fill the plane routes in both directions. Exceptions being some airlines which are able to operate hub and spoke models and where fuel is cheap like the middle east airlines. Wouldn't these types of planes be more suitable for a role in logistics which can benefit the greate…

The A340, A380, 727, 747, and L-1011 existed because of the hub-and-spoke model, and the requirement for a minimum of three engines for transoceanic flights. The 777 was the harbinger of their doom, as it brought ETOPS with it. Somewhat tangentially, there is a (strong) argument that twin-engine aircraft are actually safer than three or four engine aircraft. First, they are at lower risk of having an engine problem (…

Well, a related item is that airlines simply got tired of maintaining 4 engines (I'm putting it somewhat jokingly but not too far from the truth). For the not much better fuel efficiency and capacity, the complexity of the 747 4 engines are that much more of a headache to maintain properly.

Re: Amazon buys 11 Boeing 767s to expand its cargo fleet

#162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They do the same thing at Whole Foods with their 365 brand.

and at Costco with Kirkland and Wal-Mart with great Value and Target and something

One of targets brands is “up and up” which always gets a lol because like...trust me, these garbage bags are on the up and up. Who are you trying to convince?!

Re: Amazon buys 11 Boeing 767s to expand its cargo fleet

#163
post #84

Amazon's air safety record is less than stellar. Prime Air had a fatal 767 incident in early 2019. https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Pages/AA... In the accident flight, the first officer (FO) inadvertently activated the "go around" mode during landing, then, in surprise, pushed the airplane into the ground. > According to one check airman at [FO's previous airline], the FO could explain things well…

She said that when the FO did not know what to do, he became extremely anxious and would start pushing a lot of buttons without thinking about what he was pushing, just to be doing something.

You'd think that the simulator would be able to detect inappropriate button pushes in a given situation, and produce a report stating that it had happened more than times during an exercise. That should flag the pilot for further evaluation and training...

Re: Amazon buys 11 Boeing 767s to expand its cargo fleet

#164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They do the same thing at Whole Foods with their 365 brand.

and at Costco with Kirkland and Wal-Mart with great Value and Target and something

Agreed, I have seen Great Value things in food isle popping up after few months of something else; my personal observation was Uncle Rice ready made rice.

Re: Amazon buys 11 Boeing 767s to expand its cargo fleet

#165
It is incredible how big Amazon became. Considering the circumstances. They treat many employees like slaves with something just above minimum wage. Anti transparent pricing on everything from video to aws. Horrible ui on the platform with an incredible amount of fake reviews and products. The prices arent even better than elsewhere. I will boycott until they treat staff fairly or replace them with robots, they can treat the robots as they please but having working conditions similar to a north korean re eduction gulag is something I will not be supporting.

Re: Amazon buys 11 Boeing 767s to expand its cargo fleet

#166
post #51
post #11

I remember watching a video from Wendover Production talking about the decline of 747 and A380s mainly due to a lack of guaranteed passengers to fill the plane routes in both directions. Exceptions being some airlines which are able to operate hub and spoke models and where fuel is cheap like the middle east airlines. Wouldn't these types of planes be more suitable for a role in logistics which can benefit the greate…

I wonder, is there such a thing as a plane that carries both cargo (in a significant way) and passengers? Not sure if it would make any economic sense, but maybe it could if the layout could be changed rapidly, with a passenger cabin "slotted in" when needed.

[deleted]

Re: Amazon buys 11 Boeing 767s to expand its cargo fleet

#167
post #42

I have been wondering about whether there is a limit to how much Amazon can grow in terms of number of industries they can expand into and also how big can they grow in each of those industries. At some point, there will obviously be attempts to create legislations to stop them from growing. Such legislative maneuvers will probably be rendered ineffective by intense lobbying. I think there has be change in consumer b…

I suppose the upper limit would be becoming the economy itself. Imagine monetary policy being set by https://treasury.amazon.gov .

JP Morgan, himself, used to do this.

Re: Amazon buys 11 Boeing 767s to expand its cargo fleet

#168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They do the same thing at Whole Foods with their 365 brand.

and at Costco with Kirkland and Wal-Mart with great Value and Target and something

Well, Costco is likely just re-labelling premium brands from Campbell, P&G, etc. as Kirkland. I don't think Costco makes anything itself, or even does lowest-cost outsourcing like Walmart or Amazon do.

Safeway has at least 14 private-label brands, including Lucerne.

Re: Amazon buys 11 Boeing 767s to expand its cargo fleet

#169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They then also refused to give a unique license to the product for Amazon to my friend This is a deal-breaker always for these types of arrangements. I've walked away after months of negotiations when suppliers renege of this key part of any distribution agreement. You cannot be in a position to build up someone else's product or brand, and have them take it away from you at their own discretion, with zero compensati…

It sounds like you have some expierence. Would you mind elaborating on how one would enter this space, aquire supplies/products, examples of licensing deals. Even just some trusted resources would be fine. This fascinates me, as I have wondered how some sellers on Amazon (or eBay but no thanks) become so large just by reselling other people's things on Amazon -- at the same time Amazon is the one who really wants to…

Sure happy to help. Your email in your profile appears to be invalid, but I'll write a few things here in case other folks are interested.

They become big because the competitive edge is not in the supply, it's in the demand, as in, they have access to a customer base. Of course, one can't sell complete crap, supplies/products should fulfill a certain market demand, but supply is always secondary to having access to customers.

If you're thinking about becoming a trader or distributor, start backwards from your potential customers. Who are they, what do they want, and what price point and average buying quantity makes sense for them. If you're trading B2B that is quite different from sourcing from a supplier to sell direct to consumers in your market. In the former, your customer is the physical retail stores (or their equivalent), in the latter it is actual consumers themselves. The usual customer profile work should be done here.

Once you have an idea of your customer profile, then you can start sourcing. Luckily there are very few barriers to entry in 2021, you can google for product names or categories, find the suppliers online (China or otherwise), and you can just email them to inquire on their prices. If you're starting out, be a simple as you can:

a) What are their prices and minimum order qtys

b) Can they waive the minimum order qtys while you test out the market on the first few orders (suppliers always have excess stock on previous production runs. You can do them "a favour" by buying that - they recover their costs, you get things for cheap).

c) Pre-sell if you can. That could be as simple as walking to stores with a catalogue, or just a sample to show them. Then collect pre-orders from 50 customers (ideally with some money down), use that to make your first supplier purchase.

d) Ideally, you have exclusive rights to the distribution for several years. When you're starting out, you don't want to spend the money to "buy" these rights, so again, it becomes a negotiation. The supplier isn't selling in your market, so you're helping them reach a wider audience. It's in their interest to support you.

e) Make sure besides exclusive rights, you get collateral support in terms of marketing materials, graphics, ads, freebies, etc. This stuff is huge when you're building up a customer base.

The best structure is pre-sell, purchase from your supplier to fulfill existing orders, then the stuff arrives and you just pack it off straight to your customers. Rinse and repeat. High volume items give you about 10-15% gross margins, but standard is about 30-40% gross margins as a trader. Again, all depends on how you negotiate your total costs. Freight is often a huge win -- get some good freight charges, and your profit can literally double on a specific shipment.

Ideally in your customer identification process, you'll have found some product ideas that they'll want to buy. You are valuable because:

1. Your customers don't want to buy the volumes a supplier would require, they just want a small subset of that total. They're happy to pay a larger price for smaller quantities.

2. Suppliers don't want to sell bits and pieces, they like having someone buy large quantities from them. So they'll give you a good price for bulk purchasing. They also don't want to do the legwork to find the 100-1000 smaller customers to fill a large production order.

Your profit is the difference between the two numbers. So you do the legwork to get that upside.

If you're attempting to sell on crowded locations like Amazon, then you will need to spend/invest on ads to drive the purchasing from you (vs. someone else with the same or similar products). Most marketplaces reward sellers with existing sales volumes, as their algorithms figure you've completed sales before, you'll continue to do so. So that's a game you do need to play to start building a seller reputation. If you have your own Shopify-or-whatever site, it's the same, you'll need to do FB/Google ads to drive that initial customer acquisition.

There's a lot more info, but I'll stop here for now. Happy to write more if folks are keen.

Re: Amazon buys 11 Boeing 767s to expand its cargo fleet

#170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It sounds like you have some expierence. Would you mind elaborating on how one would enter this space, aquire supplies/products, examples of licensing deals. Even just some trusted resources would be fine. This fascinates me, as I have wondered how some sellers on Amazon (or eBay but no thanks) become so large just by reselling other people's things on Amazon -- at the same time Amazon is the one who really wants to…

Sure happy to help. Your email in your profile appears to be invalid, but I'll write a few things here in case other folks are interested. They become big because the competitive edge is not in the supply, it's in the demand, as in, they have access to a customer base. Of course, one can't sell complete crap, supplies/products should fulfill a certain market demand, but supply is always secondary to having access to…

That's already a great bit of info. Thanks much. I always ran up against the can't win the but box on your own product issue. Can't believe I didn't consider ads as a bootstrap.
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