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Termux no longer updated on Google Play

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Re: Termux no longer updated on Google Play

#231

Post by pksebben »

danShumway wrote: post #229
user-the-name wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

General purpose computing is not secure, and can most likely never be made secure.

Why did we move away from flip phones? Like seriously, what are people even arguing here? General purpose computing was a mistake? Is that seriously an argument that anyone is making in good faith as they type into their web browser on an Internet forum? Just wait until you find out that app stores are always going to have fundamentally imperfect moderation. Forget running unsigned/unapproved code, we should get rid…

so much this. I don't want to be forced into sacrificing what's possible to keep myself safe, thank you very much. I'm more than capable of performing my own risk assessments, and the further we go down the "secure the hell out of everything" road the closer we get to industrial capture of essential tech.

I think it was a piece by stallman I read recently, about the concept of hardware signature-key application whitelisting. kept me up for a week.

Re: Termux no longer updated on Google Play

#232

Post by Daho0n »

vorpalhex wrote: post #86
londons_explore wrote: post #64

TL;DR: Android is trying to enforce all data being either writable, or executable, never both. iOS already does this. There are big security benefits (it becomes much harder to exploit an app). A disadvantage is it becomes much harder to make things like terminal emulators and things that want to download random code and run it. But those are by far the minority of apps, and it seems crazy to make a pretty massive se…

> But those are by far the minority of apps, and it seems crazy to make a pretty massive security tradeoff for something that 99% of apps don't need to do. Yet oddly, I as the user who paid $550 for my device would like to do that. I understand wanting to put a warning on it, but otherwise my device can kindly screw off and do what I've told it to do, or it will be taking a one way ride out the nearest window. The de…

>The device serves me, not the other way around.

While I agree with you this is not the world we live in. We live in a world with Apple and iOS.

Re: Termux no longer updated on Google Play

#233

Post by Daho0n »

londons_explore wrote: post #132
vorpalhex wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But those are by far the minority of apps, and it seems crazy to make a pretty massive security tradeoff for something that 99% of apps don't need to do. Yet oddly, I as the user who paid $550 for my device would like to do that. I understand wanting to put a warning on it, but otherwise my device can kindly screw off and do what I've told it to do, or it will be taking a one way ride out the nearest window. The de…

My personal security metric is "how many bitcoins would I leave in a wallet app on this phone". Currently that number is about 1 ($30k) on an up to date android. I believe that if I had more bitcoins on a phone, and told people about it, there's a good chance a targeted exploit would steal those keys. Even if I had them encrypted, at some point I have to type a password in to decrypt, and that would be the point they…

There are more exploits on sale for iOS than Android. So if you had 10 bitcoins you invested them poorly and put them in the wrong phone.

Re: Termux no longer updated on Google Play

#234

Post by gnulinux »

user-the-name wrote: post #219
iagovar wrote: post #4

We have to replicate somehow the PC ecosystem into mobile phones. I'd like PostmarketOS / Manjaro to take off, hope it becomes ready as everyday driver one day.

The PC ecosystem is laughably insecure.

It is also amazingly useful and easy to program.

Re: Termux no longer updated on Google Play

#235

Post by pipework »

m45t3r wrote: post #17
swiley wrote: post #2

Between this and ish Android without third party app stores/apps is now worse than iOS.

This is far from true. Unless Google removed the possibility of installing packages from third party sources, the situation in Android for *nix username is still far better than iOS. AFAIK, iSH only runs in TestFlight right?

https://ish.app/blog/app-store-removal

Re: Termux no longer updated on Google Play

#236

Post by bitwize »

riedel wrote: post #162
drKarl wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow! That is a very big deal!!! Almost all of the Apps I have on my Android phone are installed from F-Droid, and I try to avoid installing any Apps from other sources, exceptions force upon me by my social circle, like WhatsApp. I have a PinePhone but it is not yet ready as a daily driver, and also the difference in hardware performance between my Android phone (which I bought this year) and PinePhone (or even Libre…

The problem will start with such offerings only if third parties (like employers or banks) demand turning this on. The patronizing of users that started with saftynet is horrifying. I think it will become crucial that some commercialy relevant group uses non play store content. Otherwise the affordance to use non main stream stuff will become higher and higher.

I have a strict "if you want me to use a phone for work, then issue me a work phone" policy. No, I will not install your MDM app on my personal phone, because that is tantamount to surrendering my phone to the company.

Re: Termux no longer updated on Google Play

#237

Post by bitwize »

forgotmypw17 wrote: post #80
londons_explore wrote: post #64

TL;DR: Android is trying to enforce all data being either writable, or executable, never both. iOS already does this. There are big security benefits (it becomes much harder to exploit an app). A disadvantage is it becomes much harder to make things like terminal emulators and things that want to download random code and run it. But those are by far the minority of apps, and it seems crazy to make a pretty massive se…

>But those are by far the minority of apps, and it seems crazy to make a pretty massive security tradeoff for something that 99% of apps don't need to do. It also completely eliminates general purpose computing. >One solution might be a special permission to be allowed to do that, but it seems unlikely a user could really make an informed decision. I think the way "Developer Mode" on Android is implemented is pretty…

"General purpose computing" is not something most users need or want. Whitelisting is an easy, effective way to improve your security posture w.r.t. a given device. Therefore, expect whitelisting platforms to dominate in thr coming decades.

Re: Termux no longer updated on Google Play

#238

Post by themacguffinman »

danShumway wrote: post #229
user-the-name wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

General purpose computing is not secure, and can most likely never be made secure.

Why did we move away from flip phones? Like seriously, what are people even arguing here? General purpose computing was a mistake? Is that seriously an argument that anyone is making in good faith as they type into their web browser on an Internet forum? Just wait until you find out that app stores are always going to have fundamentally imperfect moderation. Forget running unsigned/unapproved code, we should get rid…

Lay off implications about bad faith, please.

The argument is not that general purpose computing was a mistake, but that general purpose computing is not necessary and is to some extent counterproductive for the majority of consumers. Consumers moved away from flip phones because they wanted more capable phones, that doesn't mean they largely want capability to the extent of general purpose computing.

Consumers will be the judge of whether a platform or product is worth using. Given the unparalleled success of iOS and Apple's locked down ecosystem, it's pretty clear that many find this level of security is very much worth using regardless of imperfect moderation.

Re: Termux no longer updated on Google Play

#240

Post by bitwize »

lxgr wrote: post #89
londons_explore wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it interprets x86, and therefore loses a lot of performance. For just running a few bash scripts, it really doesn't matter tho.

By the way, UserLAnd [1] does something very similar on Android (and is accordingly not affected by these changes). [1] https://github.com/CypherpunkArmory/UserLAnd

Funny, all the binaries in my UserLAnd are aarch64, not x86.

I'm not sure how they do it -- faking syscalls? -- but recently, changes in Android filesystem access policies made it impossible to move files between UserLAnd and the outside Android environment.

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