Telegram publishes users' locations online • Hacker News Board

Re: Telegram publishes users' locations online

#91

Post by IlliOnato » Tue, Jan 05, 2021, 5:22 AM UTC

Melting_Harps wrote: post #60

cwhiz wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Signal is terrible. I use the app still, but it’s horribly buggy. The disappearing messages, a hallmark feature, is fundamentally broken in some way that I can’t fully comprehend. Totally unreliable. Telegram is better in every way... except security.

> Telegram is better in every way... except security. Which is why anyone bothers with these type apps in the first place, I'd like to say I'm dissapointed with the sentiment towards Signal, especially given how many here work in tech and understand how leaky these apps are designed to be and how hard development can be with a bare bones team (I experienced this first hand), but it never fails to bank on the notion t…

The problem is, even if I can be OK with bugs and problems with Signal UI, I cannot make my friends (or my 80-year-old Mom) be OK too. I personally know literally nobody who uses Signal (and a number of my friends are geeks:-)). Network effect, you know... :-(

Re: Telegram publishes users' locations online

#92

Post by tzs » Tue, Jan 05, 2021, 5:23 AM UTC

Maybe this would be a little to confusing for users, but perhaps apps that have an option to publish your location should have an option to automatically disable location publishing when you are near home, or even better when you are near any location on a user-specified list of locations.

Re: Telegram publishes users' locations online

#93

Post by luxuryballs » Tue, Jan 05, 2021, 5:24 AM UTC

So wait by showing your location on the map you show your location on the map? Scandal.

Re: Telegram publishes users' locations online

#94

Post by godelski » Tue, Jan 05, 2021, 5:25 AM UTC

Melting_Harps wrote: post #60

cwhiz wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Signal is terrible. I use the app still, but it’s horribly buggy. The disappearing messages, a hallmark feature, is fundamentally broken in some way that I can’t fully comprehend. Totally unreliable. Telegram is better in every way... except security.

> Telegram is better in every way... except security. Which is why anyone bothers with these type apps in the first place, I'd like to say I'm dissapointed with the sentiment towards Signal, especially given how many here work in tech and understand how leaky these apps are designed to be and how hard development can be with a bare bones team (I experienced this first hand), but it never fails to bank on the notion t…

> he refused to have that rock, paper, scissor match

What I thought was the funniest part (strangest) is that Moxie walked back to "I'll give you a suggestion of people and you don't even have to have any of them on" and Joe still treated it like Moxie could dictate who was going to be on the podcast. But what's the difference between that and any other guest being like "hey, you should check out ________!" which happens all the time. It was literally a nothing bet. I do think Moxie forcing the week's lineup is a bit much. A single person? Not that bad, but I could see it being used against Joe (though unlikely). But "hey you should check these people out" is nothing. Guests suggest guests all the time and so does his fanbase.

As far as Signal goes, they've almost completed every major feature I've wanted. Usernames look like they're rolling out in a few months or less and group calling works (just needs to scale). Only issues I have are that sometimes there's some latency (this seems to be more related to 1. specific peoples' phones' battery optimization settings and 2. when there are large upticks in user enrollment. So neither of these are that big of an issue for me) and I can't use markdown (essentially a non-issue). Only things I want are fairly fluffy and features I would use fairly irregularly anyways. I don't understand the distaste of UI and it hasn't been properly explained to me yet. UI looks almost identical to WhatsApp except WA is far more busy in the background (which I actually dislike) ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Re: Telegram publishes users' locations online

#95

Post by godelski » Tue, Jan 05, 2021, 5:27 AM UTC

IlliOnato wrote: post #91

Melting_Harps wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Telegram is better in every way... except security. Which is why anyone bothers with these type apps in the first place, I'd like to say I'm dissapointed with the sentiment towards Signal, especially given how many here work in tech and understand how leaky these apps are designed to be and how hard development can be with a bare bones team (I experienced this first hand), but it never fails to bank on the notion t…

The problem is, even if I can be OK with bugs and problems with Signal UI, I cannot make my friends (or my 80-year-old Mom) be OK too. I personally know literally nobody who uses Signal (and a number of my friends are geeks:-)). Network effect, you know... :-(

I'm curious what bugs you've experienced? The only ones I've seen are on my friends' phones and they are because those phones have extremely aggressive battery optimizations that essentially block Signal from running in the background. Once it is turned off then things work smoothly. I imagine this is a network effect related issue and that apps like WhatsApp are getting special presets because their popularity.

Re: Telegram publishes users' locations online

#96

Post by luxuryballs » Tue, Jan 05, 2021, 5:27 AM UTC

arthurcolle wrote: post #7

It's a shame that people still use Telegram when Signal is so much better, and has better credentials all around.

Telegram has way better: UI, search, bots, and all kinds of other juicy quality of life stuff that Signal doesn’t have. It all comes down to what you are using it for though, there’s a sliding scale that goes from the least secure app to “don’t use computers for this at all”, just like with medication, it’s all about juggling symptoms and risk.

Re: Telegram publishes users' locations online

#97

Post by 7v3x3n3sem9vv » Tue, Jan 05, 2021, 5:27 AM UTC

IlliOnato wrote: post #91

Melting_Harps wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Telegram is better in every way... except security. Which is why anyone bothers with these type apps in the first place, I'd like to say I'm dissapointed with the sentiment towards Signal, especially given how many here work in tech and understand how leaky these apps are designed to be and how hard development can be with a bare bones team (I experienced this first hand), but it never fails to bank on the notion t…

The problem is, even if I can be OK with bugs and problems with Signal UI, I cannot make my friends (or my 80-year-old Mom) be OK too. I personally know literally nobody who uses Signal (and a number of my friends are geeks:-)). Network effect, you know... :-(

Moved my grandma and some family over to it. Zero complaints after ~2 years of using it, and that's the best part about it. You don't need to be a "geek" to use it. Knowing everyone's data (at least in transit) is secure is pretty great.

Re: Telegram publishes users' locations online

#98

Post by godelski » Tue, Jan 05, 2021, 5:29 AM UTC

jjcon wrote: post #17

arthurcolle wrote: post #7

It's a shame that people still use Telegram when Signal is so much better, and has better credentials all around.

Signal has a terrible terrible ux - most people don’t care as much as the HN-er when it comes to security - they want a chat app that just works and is feature rich

What features are Signal missing? I think there's this weird dichotomy where people are complaining about a terrible UX and others not understanding what the issues are (me for one). Only features I've wanted have rolled out in the last few months or are about to roll out (>5 group calling and usernames).

Re: Telegram publishes users' locations online

#99

Post by 7v3x3n3sem9vv » Tue, Jan 05, 2021, 5:31 AM UTC

lynndotpy wrote: post #62

nnx wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a common wrong understanding. WhatsApp is end-to-end encrypted by default (using same protocol as Signal) and there’s no way to disable encryption. On the other hand Telegram chats are by default unencrypted ... you have to specifically start a “Secret Chat” to benefit from end-to-end encryption.

Correction here, Telegram is using transport encryption, while Signal and WhatsApp use end-to-end encryption.

Addendum: Signal uses end-to-end encryption AND transport encryption.

Re: Telegram publishes users' locations online

#100

Post by solarkraft » Tue, Jan 05, 2021, 5:33 AM UTC

- Clickbait headline

- Of course this shouldn't be possible, what is up with Telegram? At last make publishing your precise location optional (within that feature) with a good warning!