Being Frugal Makes You A Loser • Hacker News Board

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#201

Post by lwhi » Wed, May 18, 2011, 8:22 PM UTC

chernevik wrote: post #200

lwhi wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And you overlook the point that "better" != "more expensive". Being frugal is not mutually exclusive to living a good quality life.

Who has said that price is a reliable indicator of quality? The chief claim is that price shouldn't be the _only_ purchasing criteria. And no one has claimed that goods of any kind are essential to a "good quality life".

fru·gal/ˈfro͞ogəl/Adjective 1. Sparing or economical with regard to money or food. 2. Simple and plain and costing little: "a frugal meal".

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#202

Post by abalashov » Wed, May 18, 2011, 9:37 PM UTC

encoderer wrote: post #178

abalashov wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you've severely hyperbolised my comment. I didn't say you shouldn't be smart with your money, most especially when the cost of doing so in resources or obnoxiousness is small. I didn't say you should always pay sticker price, and never seek a good deal. I merely encourage judiciousness about the wisdom and worth-it-ness of bargain-hunting in a given situation, and the recognition that doing it in every situat…

To be fair, the example you used was haggling over a loaf of bread. Your comment was hyperbole before I got to it.

To be fair, the example you used was haggling over a loaf of bread.

You thought I was kidding? I wish I were. I ran into a woman the day before yesterday who was at Publix (www.publix.com) here in Atlanta, asserting that the identical multigrain rye was 30c cheaper at Kroger down the street and she was taking her business elsewhere.

She didn't exactly look indigent, either; I'd take pity upon someone who managed to panhandle $2 but not $2.30. She was in a smart business suit.

It's not the first, second or third time I've seen something this ridiculous lately. I can only conclude it's a trend.

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#203

Post by encoderer » Wed, May 18, 2011, 9:48 PM UTC

abalashov wrote: post #202

encoderer wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, the example you used was haggling over a loaf of bread. Your comment was hyperbole before I got to it.

To be fair, the example you used was haggling over a loaf of bread. You thought I was kidding? I wish I were. I ran into a woman the day before yesterday who was at Publix (www.publix.com) here in Atlanta, asserting that the identical multigrain rye was 30c cheaper at Kroger down the street and she was taking her business elsewhere. She didn't exactly look indigent, either; I'd take pity upon someone who managed to p…

It's not Publix's policy to price-match across the board but often will. They'll also accept competitors coupons. They also accept B1G1 Manufacturer coupons when they themselves are running a B1G1 free sale, getting you both items free.

Joke all you want, she's the smart one here. You crowing about her here has no "social cost." And you say that your POV comes from running a business. So does mine. In my case, I contract myself out. I've grown into a very high hourly rate. I have an assistant to help with things so I can add more billable hours.

But what I've learned from running a business is to guard every damn cent that goes out the door. Not spending dollars to save dimes, but spending one dime to save 2.

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#204

Post by dxbydt » Wed, May 18, 2011, 9:58 PM UTC

abalashov wrote: post #202

encoderer wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, the example you used was haggling over a loaf of bread. Your comment was hyperbole before I got to it.

To be fair, the example you used was haggling over a loaf of bread. You thought I was kidding? I wish I were. I ran into a woman the day before yesterday who was at Publix (www.publix.com) here in Atlanta, asserting that the identical multigrain rye was 30c cheaper at Kroger down the street and she was taking her business elsewhere. She didn't exactly look indigent, either; I'd take pity upon someone who managed to p…

Dude, 30 cents is a huge, HUGE deal. Dealbreaker even. And you don't have to be indigent to realize that. On wall street, IBs routinely send out managers who make seven figures to the exchanges to negotiate a 0.0001$ per share instead of 0.0002$. Entire trading platforms are swapped because some bean counter in the settlements desk thinks you can squeeze an extra penny out of the other platform. When your trading volume averages 100m$ per DAY, these point one-thousandth of a cent add up very quickly.

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#205

Post by ajkessler » Wed, May 18, 2011, 11:56 PM UTC

lionhearted wrote: post #160

AJ is saying don't cut spending on things that affect your production. That's absolutely a no-brainer. Buy yourself good tools, ensure you get good sleep, keep your health up, keep your ability to walk. Always spend more to increase your production by a bigger amount. It pays for itself in the end. Now, how much should you cut on pure consumption? That's a tricky one. I tend to cut my consumption as low as I can with…

Thanks Sebastian :) Some of the things I tried to point out in the post are things we often over look.

If you're a carpenter running a shop, it's a no-brainer to buy tools that help you be more productive and make your life easier. But, there are other tools or things we use every day, whose cumulative effects can be as important as the one big tool we spend most of our time on. Making the same smart decisions on those smaller things as we do on the larger ones isn't going to impact your bottom line in a meaningful way, but can dramatically impact your quality of life.

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#206

Post by spiffytech » Thu, May 19, 2011, 3:44 AM UTC

wickedchicken wrote: post #199

ajkessler wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting points. (I'm the original author, btw). Some thoughts: The "loser" word choice, as someone pointed out below, was a double entendre, meant to mean, first, that you're losing in the long run when you make bad/cheap purchases, and second, that I think there is a psychological effect of surrounding yourself with low quality stuff. Second, I'm really not talking about expensive v. cheap. Most of the stuff I'm…

My budget which keeps my working on my startup is roughly $10/day. Explain to me why I, using nail clippers once a month, would spend $7 more dollars (my entire food budget for a day) on better nail clippers. Small stuff adds up dude.

You're either exceptional, or live somewhere where the cost of living is very low compared to America. Even in the scuzzy college dives here in Raleigh, NC, it would be a struggle to live on $10/day ($300/month); my share of a 4-way rent split on a reasonably-decent apartment is >$300/mo.

If you're living on $300/mo in America, or somewhere with a similar cost of living (it sounds like the OP is), realize that (statistically speaking) the majority of the author's audience doesn't share your financial situation.

If you're living somewhere with a considerably lower cost of living, adjust the price of "better than bargain-bin" nail clippers for your locale, then reconsider the point the author is making.

Also, don't use nail clippers if the example doesn't fit your situation. I use nail clippers every week or two, so it's a good example for me. For you? Buy the paper plates that don't get soggy, and aren't so flimsy that you need two hands to keep your food from spilling. Or invest in a nice set of real plates once that you can use forever, instead of buying paper plates every couple of weeks.

Generalize. Don't reject the OP's point just because one specific example doesn't fit your lifestyle.

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#207

Post by keeptrying » Thu, May 19, 2011, 4:01 AM UTC

iskander wrote: post #153

keeptrying wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you don't buy a good bed you'll develop back issues. And actually the majority of sedentary workers will have back issues in their lives so it's even more important. This rule works for me and since it's not actually straight forward to figure out, I thought it would help others.

...or you could put a lightly padded mat on the floor. The cost is minimal and it makes my back feel healthier than a bed. As far as I can tell, beds are for comfort not health.

Yeah but that gets some getting used to. My dad sleeps like that :) ...

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#208

Post by wickedchicken » Thu, May 19, 2011, 5:59 AM UTC

spiffytech wrote: post #206

wickedchicken wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My budget which keeps my working on my startup is roughly $10/day. Explain to me why I, using nail clippers once a month, would spend $7 more dollars (my entire food budget for a day) on better nail clippers. Small stuff adds up dude.

You're either exceptional, or live somewhere where the cost of living is very low compared to America. Even in the scuzzy college dives here in Raleigh, NC, it would be a struggle to live on $10/day ($300/month); my share of a 4-way rent split on a reasonably-decent apartment is >$300/mo. If you're living on $300/mo in America, or somewhere with a similar cost of living (it sounds like the OP is), realize that (stati…

$10/day ignoring rent, sorry. The thing is, there is no point spending extra money on things you don't care about. None. Thinking otherwise is an unfortunate habit that a lot of people (myself included) pick up. "Oh, I'll buy the middle of the road X because it probably is better than the cheap one." It's a habit I've spent a lot of mental energy trying to unlearn and I apologize if I get a little touchy when people suggest I "don't respect myself" when I attempt to be cost-effective. I would much rather be defined by the stuff I make than the stuff I buy.

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#209

Post by roel_v » Thu, May 19, 2011, 7:53 AM UTC

jowiar wrote: post #196

roel_v wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know about Ferragamo, but I do own several pairs ( gasp !) of shoes in that price range from a famous shoe brand here ("van Bommel", for the Dutch reading this, and in case it matters). They will last for decades with proper care and resoling every couple of years, but that's not the reason I bought them; I'm pretty sure that after 15 years I'll want something different, vareity being the spice of life and al…

I was not implying the Ferragamos were the wrong choice. Rather, the Boss/Diesel/etc. "designer" stuff that is probably made in the exact same Chinese factory as the $50 equivalents. I was trying to say "get it cheap, or get it right" No arguments here on appearance.

Oh sorry, then I misunderstood you, and my whole argument doesn't make sense any more :)

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#210

Post by danssig » Thu, May 19, 2011, 9:57 AM UTC

wickedchicken wrote: post #197

danssig wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like you're a "frugal" person who got offended at this (correct) message. >Also, a downside of 'nice stuff' is you have to lug it everywhere. What on earth are you talking about? If you buy a cheap generic $200 17" laptop you'll have to lug it around just as much as a nice MBP. The difference is; you'll have to replace the cheapy about 10 times in the lifetime of my MBP.

> Sounds like you're a "frugal" person who got offended at this (correct) message. Sweet ad hominem attack, bro. > The difference is; you'll have to replace the cheapy about 10 times in the lifetime of my MBP. And when that sweet MBP gets stolen or you spill tea all over it rendering it useless, you have to spend a ton more to get it back/working again. People keep saying "I never have to think about it again!!!" but…

I protect my laptop whether it's a $3k top-of-the-line MBP of a $200 Aldi special. The valuable part of my laptop is what's stored on it, not the eq itself which I have insured against theft.